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> the idea of either Intel or Samsung complaining about some other company subverting competition is hilarious. But I guess that's how the game is played at thi

> the idea of either Intel or Samsung complaining about some other company subverting competition is hilarious. But I guess that's how the game is played at this level. Agreed. I think this is what's happening: Big tech companies have realized they need to expand into other markets (intel and samsung being prime examples). The only markets left that are big enough are monopolies protected by patents, with Qualcomm being a prime example. Entirely new markets are less interesting because they're not big enough. Even with massive growth, it will take too long for them to become big enough. A.I. is a maybe, but that market is hardly proven. The money in A.I. might be in reforming companies from the inside instead of selling products to those same companies. There's going to be more money in invalidating patents and moving into the industries that suddenly opens than there is in actually benefitting from patent royalties. Winning the war on patent trolls would speed this process up. Once people realize that companies that derive a large percentage of their income from patent portfolios are just big dead rotting corpses waiting to be dismantled, the world will be a better place.

zokier 9y ago
> Big tech companies have realized they need to expand into other markets (intel and samsung being prime examples). I'm not sure if Samsung is a good example of this. They have been making Exynos chips for a long time, and other ARM SoCs before that. So its not like they have suddenly awakened and trying to break into new market.
tooltalk 9y ago
No, that's not what's happening here. While Qualcomm holds a lot of wireless patents and they are entitled to make money for what they have contributed, they also agreed to declare their patents as part of the ETSI CDMA, LTE standards. This is beneficial for Qualcomm because now everyone HAS to use and license their patents, so they have guaranteed income. But, at the same time, they are also required to license their patents at fair and reasonable terms regardless of who licensees are. Qualcomm violated their FRAND obligations in two very blatant ways. First, they REFUSED to license their patents to competing baseband makers, like Intel, Samsung, and other baseband makers. KFTC last year also found out that Qualcomm barred Samsung from marketing and selling their own AP/baseband chips in certain market (US) for some 20 years. So it also runs a foul of US anti-trust/anti-competitive laws. If Qualcomm wants the kind of legal patent monopoly enjoyed by pharma's for instance, they need to keep their patents proprietary, and not declare them to SSO's. Qualcomm is trying to force everyone to license their tech as SSO's standards, then break every rule they agreed to uphold to maintain their dominance.
- dave_sullivan 9y ago
  Sorry, I'm not sure how what you said contradicts what I said (as in "No, that's not what's happening here"). It's certainly useful, specific information, but it doesn't negate my broader point.

zokier 9y ago

> Big tech companies have realized they need to expand into other markets (intel and samsung being prime examples). I'm not sure if Samsung is a good example of this. They have been making Exynos chips for a long time, and other ARM SoCs before that. So its not like they have suddenly awakened and trying to break into new market.

tooltalk 9y ago

No, that's not what's happening here. While Qualcomm holds a lot of wireless patents and they are entitled to make money for what they have contributed, they also agreed to declare their patents as part of the ETSI CDMA, LTE standards. This is beneficial for Qualcomm because now everyone HAS to use and license their patents, so they have guaranteed income. But, at the same time, they are also required to license their patents at fair and reasonable terms regardless of who licensees are. Qualcomm violated their FRAND obligations in two very blatant ways. First, they REFUSED to license their patents to competing baseband makers, like Intel, Samsung, and other baseband makers. KFTC last year also found out that Qualcomm barred Samsung from marketing and selling their own AP/baseband chips in certain market (US) for some 20 years. So it also runs a foul of US anti-trust/anti-competitive laws. If Qualcomm wants the kind of legal patent monopoly enjoyed by pharma's for instance, they need to keep their patents proprietary, and not declare them to SSO's. Qualcomm is trying to force everyone to license their tech as SSO's standards, then break every rule they agreed to uphold to maintain their dominance.

dave_sullivan 9y ago
Sorry, I'm not sure how what you said contradicts what I said (as in "No, that's not what's happening here"). It's certainly useful, specific information, but it doesn't negate my broader point.