3 ms·

I find it hard to take a 2.4% difference observed through what seems to be a self reported, necessarily imperfect survey[0] seriously. [0] http://www.payscale.

I find it hard to take a 2.4% difference observed through what seems to be a self reported, necessarily imperfect survey[0] seriously. [0] http://www.payscale.com/about/methodology http://www.payscale.com/about/methodology

wanderr 9y ago
The meta argument I am trying to make is that recent arguments about this have shifted to including accounting for jobs (and usually experience levels), since jecjec was claiming that it's still the antiquated version that does not account for any of those things. If you want to have a discussion about the quality of any of those articles or the studies they're based on, well, that's a different discussion entirely, I present these as evidence that the discussion has moved, not that any of them are correct.
- kobeya 9y ago
  The point is that 2.4% is within the error of such a survey. So effectively the result of the survey is that there is no pay gap.
  - wanderr 9y ago
    the point is, you're arguing with the article, not my point.
- mpweiher 9y ago
  > arguments about this have shifted Only in a Motte-Bailey sense [1][2]. PM: "77 cents to the dollar, it's a crime!!" DO: "That's complete BS". PM: "Well, you're right, here is more reasonable data" DO: "But that doesn't actually show a gap" PM: "Oh my god, 77 cents to the dollar!!" [1] http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/11/03/all-in-all-another-brick-in-the-motte/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/11/03/all-in-all-another-bric... [2] https://philpapers.org/archive/SHATVO-2.pdf https://philpapers.org/archive/SHATVO-2.pdf
DanBC 9y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14335076 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14335076 This comment links to a rigorous English dataset. Band 5 staff earn between £21k and £28k. Band 8d staff earn between £65k and £81k. When we restrict ourselves to a single healthcare profession (in this example I used widwives) that has many more women than men at the entry level jobs we still see men being promoted above women.
- pottersbasilisk 9y ago
  Keep on moving the goalposts. It doesnt change the fact there is no general wage gap when experience and accurate jobs comparison are taken into account. In 2017, equal work DOES have equal pay.

wanderr 9y ago

The meta argument I am trying to make is that recent arguments about this have shifted to including accounting for jobs (and usually experience levels), since jecjec was claiming that it's still the antiquated version that does not account for any of those things. If you want to have a discussion about the quality of any of those articles or the studies they're based on, well, that's a different discussion entirely, I present these as evidence that the discussion has moved, not that any of them are correct.

kobeya 9y ago
The point is that 2.4% is within the error of such a survey. So effectively the result of the survey is that there is no pay gap.
- wanderr 9y ago
  the point is, you're arguing with the article, not my point.
mpweiher 9y ago
> arguments about this have shifted Only in a Motte-Bailey sense [1][2]. PM: "77 cents to the dollar, it's a crime!!" DO: "That's complete BS". PM: "Well, you're right, here is more reasonable data" DO: "But that doesn't actually show a gap" PM: "Oh my god, 77 cents to the dollar!!" [1] http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/11/03/all-in-all-another-brick-in-the-motte/ http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/11/03/all-in-all-another-bric... [2] https://philpapers.org/archive/SHATVO-2.pdf https://philpapers.org/archive/SHATVO-2.pdf

DanBC 9y ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14335076 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14335076 This comment links to a rigorous English dataset. Band 5 staff earn between £21k and £28k. Band 8d staff earn between £65k and £81k. When we restrict ourselves to a single healthcare profession (in this example I used widwives) that has many more women than men at the entry level jobs we still see men being promoted above women.

pottersbasilisk 9y ago
Keep on moving the goalposts. It doesnt change the fact there is no general wage gap when experience and accurate jobs comparison are taken into account. In 2017, equal work DOES have equal pay.