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LOL nothing compared to China. China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. They get all t

LOL nothing compared to China. China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. They get all the access to the West's markets and then give almost no access to their own. Their companies are all backed by the government and it's rigged in their favor. They cheat constantly, check out the EU scandal where they smuggle goods into London don't pay equal taxes as the EU companies, beat out competition who is playing fairly and then jack up prices. Their immigration policies are one of the worst in the world. Human rights violations insanely high. They purchase our movie studios and then force on them Chinese propaganda and nothing negative on China ever. America is one of the least protectionist countries in the world if not the least.

matt_wulfeck 9y ago
China doesn't even allow its own citizens to read about things like the Tiananmen square massacre. If they could censor the rest of the world they would. Even their citizens abroad will tow their party's line [0] 0. http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-essential-education-updates-southern-uc-davis-lands-the-dalai-lama-as-1487270569-htmlstory.html http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-essential-educati...
- Kali909 9y ago
  Bit pedantic but it's 'toe the line' [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line
icantdrive55 9y ago
"Oh--Yea, here's are land. Just make a phone call when you get home!" Is it any wonder why people fell into Trump's blather? I do give China credit. The government literally subsidizes (I believe) part of business shipping. The only reason Alibaba, or the the cousin something express hasen't decimated many of our markets is it takes over a month to ship.
stupidhn 9y ago
>They purchase our movie studios and then force on them Chinese propaganda and nothing negative on China ever. They are free to do what they want with what they have bought and paid for. >if not the least Lol is right.
- cylinder 9y ago
  Don't you know, Hollywood has never pushed American propaganda before...
  - propman 9y ago
    Umm I don't think you are getting the fundamental logic here. America has pushed propaganda, but they also allow movies that make America look bad: botched CIA missions true or not, slavery, different look at revered historical figures, greedy American leaders/FBI/CIA or whatever. They don't purposefully stop what makes America look bad. China does, there is a huge difference in that. Secondly, the government itself doesn't control what gets pushed out (in very rare classified instances .001% they have before) the free market does. Some audiences love pro American movies, some love anti-American but it's capitalism not propaganda
    - thablackbull 9y ago
      What you're witnessing is manufactured consent[1]. There is no need for the crude methods of propaganda here because it's not even necessary. Compare that with China; people there are fully conscious of government propaganda. From the SMH article, they expected the west to be a land of freedom and democratization of ideas, but what they end up finding is that it more or less is the same thing. > [2] "A lot of them are PRC students who migrated to Australia or come here to study. I think they are quite ambivalent about Australia, and China. Culturally and emotionally they still identify with China, but they don't like the corruption, pollution, propaganda or the regime. So they migrate here and they have some perception about this country, that it's beautiful, clean, prosperous, there is press freedom and the media is objective, not like the propaganda in China. "Here they expect the media to do a lot better than the media they're used to back there. When they realise that the media here is just as one-track mind about these things as the Chinese side but exactly the opposite, they find it really hard to reconcile with what they're experiencing." Personally, I find that even more worrying. People here seem to think they are free-thinkers not subject to propaganda when really, the more "oppressed" people have way more understanding of what's going on in the world. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent [2] http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-media-a-threat-to-social-cohesion-but-propaganda-overstated-report-20160908-grbp9j.html http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-media-a-threat-to-soc...
cylinder 9y ago
I don't see how stealing IP is protectionism. Theft, sure, but not protectionism.
- CuriousSkeptic 9y ago
  I would say it's the other way around. Negotiating international trade agreements with the purpose of limiting the flow of information by means of "IP" is the very definition of protectionism.
  - Retric 9y ago
    Mutual IP agreements are not protectionism just an equal playing field. Protecting domestic companies, but not foreign ones on the other hand is the definition of protectionism. PS: Abolishing IP would also be a level playing field, but again that's not what they are doing.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - candiodari 9y ago
      If you think China's IP practices are intended to create an equal playing field, you're more than just a little bit naive. Also mostly Chinese domestic companies' protectionism is about the same thing as the European version of the same is : getting enough Chinese people jobs so they don't revolt.
flamedoge 9y ago
ok sure. we suspect China does all these things under the cover. But what are we going to do about it? Are we just going to shut ourselves in border and let China take these developing markets?
cma 9y ago
>China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. Where have I heard of something like that in US history class? > He learned of the American interest in developing similar machines, and he was also aware of British laws against exporting the designs. He therefore memorized as much as he could and departed for New York in 1789. Some people of Belper called him "Slater the Traitor", as they considered his move a betrayal of the town where many earned their living at Strutt's mills.[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater

matt_wulfeck 9y ago

China doesn't even allow its own citizens to read about things like the Tiananmen square massacre. If they could censor the rest of the world they would. Even their citizens abroad will tow their party's line [0] 0. http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-essential-education-updates-southern-uc-davis-lands-the-dalai-lama-as-1487270569-htmlstory.html http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-essential-educati...

Kali909 9y ago
Bit pedantic but it's 'toe the line' [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line

icantdrive55 9y ago

"Oh--Yea, here's are land. Just make a phone call when you get home!" Is it any wonder why people fell into Trump's blather? I do give China credit. The government literally subsidizes (I believe) part of business shipping. The only reason Alibaba, or the the cousin something express hasen't decimated many of our markets is it takes over a month to ship.

stupidhn 9y ago

>They purchase our movie studios and then force on them Chinese propaganda and nothing negative on China ever. They are free to do what they want with what they have bought and paid for. >if not the least Lol is right.

cylinder 9y ago
Don't you know, Hollywood has never pushed American propaganda before...
- propman 9y ago
  Umm I don't think you are getting the fundamental logic here. America has pushed propaganda, but they also allow movies that make America look bad: botched CIA missions true or not, slavery, different look at revered historical figures, greedy American leaders/FBI/CIA or whatever. They don't purposefully stop what makes America look bad. China does, there is a huge difference in that. Secondly, the government itself doesn't control what gets pushed out (in very rare classified instances .001% they have before) the free market does. Some audiences love pro American movies, some love anti-American but it's capitalism not propaganda
  - thablackbull 9y ago
    What you're witnessing is manufactured consent[1]. There is no need for the crude methods of propaganda here because it's not even necessary. Compare that with China; people there are fully conscious of government propaganda. From the SMH article, they expected the west to be a land of freedom and democratization of ideas, but what they end up finding is that it more or less is the same thing. > [2] "A lot of them are PRC students who migrated to Australia or come here to study. I think they are quite ambivalent about Australia, and China. Culturally and emotionally they still identify with China, but they don't like the corruption, pollution, propaganda or the regime. So they migrate here and they have some perception about this country, that it's beautiful, clean, prosperous, there is press freedom and the media is objective, not like the propaganda in China. "Here they expect the media to do a lot better than the media they're used to back there. When they realise that the media here is just as one-track mind about these things as the Chinese side but exactly the opposite, they find it really hard to reconcile with what they're experiencing." Personally, I find that even more worrying. People here seem to think they are free-thinkers not subject to propaganda when really, the more "oppressed" people have way more understanding of what's going on in the world. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent [2] http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-media-a-threat-to-social-cohesion-but-propaganda-overstated-report-20160908-grbp9j.html http://www.smh.com.au/national/chinese-media-a-threat-to-soc...

cylinder 9y ago

I don't see how stealing IP is protectionism. Theft, sure, but not protectionism.

CuriousSkeptic 9y ago
I would say it's the other way around. Negotiating international trade agreements with the purpose of limiting the flow of information by means of "IP" is the very definition of protectionism.
- Retric 9y ago
  Mutual IP agreements are not protectionism just an equal playing field. Protecting domestic companies, but not foreign ones on the other hand is the definition of protectionism. PS: Abolishing IP would also be a level playing field, but again that's not what they are doing.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - candiodari 9y ago
    If you think China's IP practices are intended to create an equal playing field, you're more than just a little bit naive. Also mostly Chinese domestic companies' protectionism is about the same thing as the European version of the same is : getting enough Chinese people jobs so they don't revolt.

flamedoge 9y ago

ok sure. we suspect China does all these things under the cover. But what are we going to do about it? Are we just going to shut ourselves in border and let China take these developing markets?

cma 9y ago

>China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. Where have I heard of something like that in US history class? > He learned of the American interest in developing similar machines, and he was also aware of British laws against exporting the designs. He therefore memorized as much as he could and departed for New York in 1789. Some people of Belper called him "Slater the Traitor", as they considered his move a betrayal of the town where many earned their living at Strutt's mills.[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater