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So we need a minimum wage? Or "capitalism will self-regulate"? Isn't this just yet another example that our system is a total failure that requires constant tw

So we need a minimum wage? Or "capitalism will self-regulate"? Isn't this just yet another example that our system is a total failure that requires constant tweaking / intervention? Imagine someone here writing a post about a program to perform a mathematical operation. It gives the wrong answer. It takes ages to run also. But if you attach gdb, set a breakpoint and increment the necessary variables you can get the right answer. They'd be laughed out of town.

rzwitserloot 9y ago
This is sweden; a country with a fine social safety net and no significant unemployment issues. I have no idea if capitalism will self-regulate, but I'm not sure this is indicative either way. The problem here appears to be that Uber is just plain lying about how much you actually earn. As the article seems to indicate, this results in the delivery crew calling it quits after a month. I assume, if you had told uber eats 'employees' what's actually going to happen _before_ they go in for the interview, they wouldn't even go for it. Journalism like this will spread the word. More to the point, uber eats is one of the first such companies, so presumably people looking for a job in Sweden simply do not even consider they can be swindled out of a fair wage like this. A few more uber eats and presumably word gets out and people will go online and do a little bit of research prior to taking these jobs. Between the vast numbers who won't even go for the interview and the fact that the few that do tend to wash out after a month, uber eats will soon find themselves with no drivers at all. At which point they have to pack up shop and probably end the adventure in the red (it does cost money to set up, advertise, etc), or start marketing that they NOW _DO_ pay a nice wage. TL;DR: Uber is a shitty company that lies, but Swedes still need to learn they have to check what they're told for such freelance-based jobs, which is why they can currently get away with the scam.
- jacobr 9y ago
  > Between the vast numbers who won't even go for the interview and the fact that the few that do tend to wash out after a month, uber eats will soon find themselves with no drivers at all. A significant number of the drivers are recently arrived immigrants with little chance to get another job. They definitely don't read Breakit. They are not in a situation to pick-and-choose. They might get by on a small wage by working crazy hours and sharing a cheap apartment with dozens of others in the same situation.
  - Fnoord 9y ago
    They might not read Breakit, but they might have internet access and might use Google where this article might get a high rank. This is also why internet access is important. Almost as important as having clothes, food/water, and a roof above your head.
kwhitefoot 9y ago
We need to side step the need for wage regulation by giving the employees the ability to negotiate wages. This can be done with a universal basic income. We should also reform the tax systems to ensure that the tax plus social security system is smoothly and monotonically progressive to avoid the problem that increasing your gross income can reduce your net income as often happens in the UK.
- branchless 9y ago
  Yes I agree, that is a systemic change instead of a fudge. I'd only want UBI if it's funded by LVT though as otherwise rent will simply absorb UBI funnelling yet more money to landlords and banks. I'd get rid of income tax and replace with land value tax. Perhaps something at the extreme upper (> 200k) end but mostly I'd make rentiers pay.
Fnoord 9y ago
> Imagine someone here writing a post about a program to perform a mathematical operation. It gives the wrong answer. It takes ages to run also. But if you attach gdb, set a breakpoint and increment the necessary variables you can get the right answer. Won't surprise me if you can find this on Amazon Mechanical Turk. Also, on a related note, there's enough jobs in IT which are already low wage as it is.

rzwitserloot 9y ago

This is sweden; a country with a fine social safety net and no significant unemployment issues. I have no idea if capitalism will self-regulate, but I'm not sure this is indicative either way. The problem here appears to be that Uber is just plain lying about how much you actually earn. As the article seems to indicate, this results in the delivery crew calling it quits after a month. I assume, if you had told uber eats 'employees' what's actually going to happen _before_ they go in for the interview, they wouldn't even go for it. Journalism like this will spread the word. More to the point, uber eats is one of the first such companies, so presumably people looking for a job in Sweden simply do not even consider they can be swindled out of a fair wage like this. A few more uber eats and presumably word gets out and people will go online and do a little bit of research prior to taking these jobs. Between the vast numbers who won't even go for the interview and the fact that the few that do tend to wash out after a month, uber eats will soon find themselves with no drivers at all. At which point they have to pack up shop and probably end the adventure in the red (it does cost money to set up, advertise, etc), or start marketing that they NOW _DO_ pay a nice wage. TL;DR: Uber is a shitty company that lies, but Swedes still need to learn they have to check what they're told for such freelance-based jobs, which is why they can currently get away with the scam.

jacobr 9y ago
> Between the vast numbers who won't even go for the interview and the fact that the few that do tend to wash out after a month, uber eats will soon find themselves with no drivers at all. A significant number of the drivers are recently arrived immigrants with little chance to get another job. They definitely don't read Breakit. They are not in a situation to pick-and-choose. They might get by on a small wage by working crazy hours and sharing a cheap apartment with dozens of others in the same situation.
- Fnoord 9y ago
  They might not read Breakit, but they might have internet access and might use Google where this article might get a high rank. This is also why internet access is important. Almost as important as having clothes, food/water, and a roof above your head.

kwhitefoot 9y ago

We need to side step the need for wage regulation by giving the employees the ability to negotiate wages. This can be done with a universal basic income. We should also reform the tax systems to ensure that the tax plus social security system is smoothly and monotonically progressive to avoid the problem that increasing your gross income can reduce your net income as often happens in the UK.

branchless 9y ago
Yes I agree, that is a systemic change instead of a fudge. I'd only want UBI if it's funded by LVT though as otherwise rent will simply absorb UBI funnelling yet more money to landlords and banks. I'd get rid of income tax and replace with land value tax. Perhaps something at the extreme upper (> 200k) end but mostly I'd make rentiers pay.

Fnoord 9y ago

> Imagine someone here writing a post about a program to perform a mathematical operation. It gives the wrong answer. It takes ages to run also. But if you attach gdb, set a breakpoint and increment the necessary variables you can get the right answer. Won't surprise me if you can find this on Amazon Mechanical Turk. Also, on a related note, there's enough jobs in IT which are already low wage as it is.