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... and two minutes later the name of the brave person will be manure. Not because one's egregiously wrong, not because of lack of ethics, but because it'll be

... and two minutes later the name of the brave person will be manure. Not because one's egregiously wrong, not because of lack of ethics, but because it'll be affecting many powerful people and their emissaries in the academia. Common story in the GMO industry. Oh, and it doesn't hurt to be prepared for all the ad hominem hit pieces: "Left loony" "commie" "anti-science" ... The conquering grounds for the corporatocracy is also the developing world, a place which naively swallows whatever any of the reigning superpowers throw at it (hint: India is not/never will be a superpower). Very sad this.

civilian 9y ago
So I mean, if you're trying to take a stand against pesticides, you should _be in favor_ of the Bt-toxin GMOs. The GMOs that produce their own pesticide are great, because there ends up being _less_ pesticide in the field in general. (The alternative to having a plant producing their own GMOs is that, obviously, they'll just dump the field with pesticides.) Bt-toxin is also fairly specific to which insects it effects: https://gmoanswers.com/ask/how-can-adding-lot-toxic-poison-pesticides-ground-be-good https://gmoanswers.com/ask/how-can-adding-lot-toxic-poison-p... (this is a pro-gmo site, but the guy answering is still an Associate Professor, which has to count for something.) Please note that organic foods still use pesticides, even though the pesticides come from "natural sources". Keep in mind that "natural sources" doesn't mean anything-- arsenic is naturally occurring. :) https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogsscientificamericancomscience-sushi20110718mythbusting-101-organic-farming-conventional-agriculture/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogs...
- Stanish 9y ago
  I don't see how any of this makes sense given the very real possibility of not using either standard or endemic pesticides, the long term ecological (and public health) consequences of which we still have very little idea. Yes organic ag uses some techniques whose sustainability is highly dubious. There are, however, plenty of models like silvopasture, agroecology, and permaculture-informed production out there that can produce better, regionally appropriate food in ways that enhance and adapt to--rather than violently work against--the native parameters of the environment. This is the only legitimate and reasonable way forward in my eyes, and it creates so many side benefits like community, beauty, health, carbon sequestration in the soil, etc. Most high-tech industrial/corporate approaches I've seen are really just more filigree on an outdated barbaric WW2-era approach of using highly carbon intensive machinery to burn out soil and grow monocrops, kept on life support by high-"tech", low-wisdom approaches which are at their core incredibly lazy, mediocre, and destructive. My secret wish (I'm a land designer who uses GIS for this purpose) is for people like the ones on this board realizing it and flocking to the field to create data-driven approaches to true agroecology to solve hunger and climate change. P.S. for just one example of an alternative model, see Mark Shepard, a mechanical engineer and ecologist who started a hundred acre farm in Wisconsin 20 years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRhvrHeleoI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRhvrHeleoI

civilian 9y ago

So I mean, if you're trying to take a stand against pesticides, you should _be in favor_ of the Bt-toxin GMOs. The GMOs that produce their own pesticide are great, because there ends up being _less_ pesticide in the field in general. (The alternative to having a plant producing their own GMOs is that, obviously, they'll just dump the field with pesticides.) Bt-toxin is also fairly specific to which insects it effects: https://gmoanswers.com/ask/how-can-adding-lot-toxic-poison-pesticides-ground-be-good https://gmoanswers.com/ask/how-can-adding-lot-toxic-poison-p... (this is a pro-gmo site, but the guy answering is still an Associate Professor, which has to count for something.) Please note that organic foods still use pesticides, even though the pesticides come from "natural sources". Keep in mind that "natural sources" doesn't mean anything-- arsenic is naturally occurring. :) https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogsscientificamericancomscience-sushi20110718mythbusting-101-organic-farming-conventional-agriculture/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogs...

Stanish 9y ago
I don't see how any of this makes sense given the very real possibility of not using either standard or endemic pesticides, the long term ecological (and public health) consequences of which we still have very little idea. Yes organic ag uses some techniques whose sustainability is highly dubious. There are, however, plenty of models like silvopasture, agroecology, and permaculture-informed production out there that can produce better, regionally appropriate food in ways that enhance and adapt to--rather than violently work against--the native parameters of the environment. This is the only legitimate and reasonable way forward in my eyes, and it creates so many side benefits like community, beauty, health, carbon sequestration in the soil, etc. Most high-tech industrial/corporate approaches I've seen are really just more filigree on an outdated barbaric WW2-era approach of using highly carbon intensive machinery to burn out soil and grow monocrops, kept on life support by high-"tech", low-wisdom approaches which are at their core incredibly lazy, mediocre, and destructive. My secret wish (I'm a land designer who uses GIS for this purpose) is for people like the ones on this board realizing it and flocking to the field to create data-driven approaches to true agroecology to solve hunger and climate change. P.S. for just one example of an alternative model, see Mark Shepard, a mechanical engineer and ecologist who started a hundred acre farm in Wisconsin 20 years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRhvrHeleoI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRhvrHeleoI