6 ms·

It will be interesting to see how this pans out for developers that stay in the UK, like myself. It's too hard a call it either way. In the current anti-immigra

It will be interesting to see how this pans out for developers that stay in the UK, like myself. It's too hard a call it either way. In the current anti-immigration climate I can't see the UK tech industry competing as well as it has been.

hd4 9y ago
Same thoughts here, but we stand to come off well in any case. The less programming talent being allowed in, the more we can demand. I'm preparing to move on from one contract and going to see if I can triple the rate for the next one.
- fahadkhan 9y ago
  "the more we can demand." As long as there is work to do!
guitarbill 9y ago
> It will be interesting to see how this pans out for developers that stay in the UK Positive side: Less tech people = more money (which already has happened IMO, although maybe that's simply because accounting in big companies is in USD). Negative side: Less tech people... EU techies have already started to move away. And some of the UK companies I've kept in touch with are really struggling to hire now. Personally, I'd always take a good office atmosphere/culture over more pay and a less skilled team. As for non-EU techies, judging from one of our co-workers, getting a UK visa is horribly complicated. Don't think they'll make up the numbers fast.
- pjmlp 9y ago
  Another issue that remains to be seen how UK will handle it, is that all EU related projects cannot be delivered from non-EU countries without a data agreement in place. So those projects being delivered from UK either need to move into a EU country or start ramping up EU compliant data agreements.
- RegW 9y ago
  > Less tech people = more money Hmmm. Only if the jobs stay in the UK. We continue to use the EU techies - but at offices elsewhere within the EU.
  - guitarbill 9y ago
    Even if some jobs leave, if you're above average you'll probably be okay. You'll always need techies, and they'll always be business cases where techies in the country are needed, or where businesses need it done right now. Still not a great atmosphere though...
- drrob 9y ago
  To be fair we're already experiencing the beginnings of "Less tech people = more money"; the contract job I've just started hired me due to the "staffing adjustment" of some of their European coders. The result is £925 a day for me, which in east midlands UK is a very tasty morsel.
  - osullivj 9y ago
    I've been hoping contract day rates would go up too. But 925 in the East Mids is amazing. I'm intruiged - would you mind emailing (see profile) some details?
    - drrob 9y ago
      I'll email you at the Spreadserve one in a bit.
  - skydoo 9y ago
    May I talk to you to know about how can I find such opportunitiy? I am looking to move to London, and want to evaluate my options. May you email me: skfix at outlook.com
    - drrob 9y ago
      There are some specific circumstances surrounding what I'm doing, so consider £925 as an ultra-rare, not-in-any-way indicative dayrate. To be fair even in London that would be high, though I know some fintech consultants can get that and more. And legacy language guys. In summary I'm a SaaS guy, being used to replace 3 Europeans who aren't likely to be there long-term to continue to build the product beyond its initial launch. My (albeit extortionate) day rate is less than their 3 combined, so it made sense for the company. Right place right time for me. For colour, from your perspective: if you can get £500 a day in London that's not bad at all, up here in the East Midlands (I'm near Nottingham) I can get £350 to £400 a day, though I would normally trade some back for work flexibility (I prefer to work less than 8 hours a day).
      - 9y ago
blibble 9y ago
the only thing that is likely to halt is the unrestricted freedom of movement for EU workers the view amongst the UK electorate is not and has never been "all immigration is bad", surveys reveal that a majority of the UK electorate actually support an increase in migration of highly skilled workers they simply perceive unskilled migration to be a problem, and within the EU there is no ability to control it as a result: for the highly skilled from other parts of the world it will likely become easier and cheaper to migrate to the UK (and the government has been making noises to this effect)
- arethuza 9y ago
  'the view amongst the UK electorate is not and has never been "all immigration is bad"' So why the fascination with net migration figures and the desire by some elements to have "one in one out"? Edit: I do tend to worry that post Brexit there will be no reduction in net migration figures and there will be a resurgence of support for the far right who want to deliver on no immigration at all.
  - TechnicalVault 9y ago
    I suspect that more of a press obsession with pretty graphs and dramatic pronouncements than actual public interest. Give the press something more interesting to talk about and it'll pretty soon leave the front page.
    - arethuza 9y ago
      Immigration was arguably the central topic for the Leave campaign and it was known to "resonate" very strongly with certain groups of voters. Not sure how you can argue that there is no "actual public interest" in the topic. See: "All Out War" by Tim Shipman for more on this - a really excellent book.
      - lhnz 9y ago
        The British public think a good trade deal with the EU is more important than cutting immigration when negotiating Brexit [0]. Remember that about 20% of the leavers are 'liberal leavers' - they are pro-migration. Once you add this group to the remainers it's clear that a minority of anti-immigration voters shouldn't decide politics for everybody else. [0] http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-people-want-a-soft-brexit-putting-the-economy-ahead-of-cutting-immigration-poll-a7363336.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-people...

hd4 9y ago

Same thoughts here, but we stand to come off well in any case. The less programming talent being allowed in, the more we can demand. I'm preparing to move on from one contract and going to see if I can triple the rate for the next one.

fahadkhan 9y ago
"the more we can demand." As long as there is work to do!

guitarbill 9y ago

> It will be interesting to see how this pans out for developers that stay in the UK Positive side: Less tech people = more money (which already has happened IMO, although maybe that's simply because accounting in big companies is in USD). Negative side: Less tech people... EU techies have already started to move away. And some of the UK companies I've kept in touch with are really struggling to hire now. Personally, I'd always take a good office atmosphere/culture over more pay and a less skilled team. As for non-EU techies, judging from one of our co-workers, getting a UK visa is horribly complicated. Don't think they'll make up the numbers fast.

pjmlp 9y ago
Another issue that remains to be seen how UK will handle it, is that all EU related projects cannot be delivered from non-EU countries without a data agreement in place. So those projects being delivered from UK either need to move into a EU country or start ramping up EU compliant data agreements.
RegW 9y ago
> Less tech people = more money Hmmm. Only if the jobs stay in the UK. We continue to use the EU techies - but at offices elsewhere within the EU.
- guitarbill 9y ago
  Even if some jobs leave, if you're above average you'll probably be okay. You'll always need techies, and they'll always be business cases where techies in the country are needed, or where businesses need it done right now. Still not a great atmosphere though...
drrob 9y ago
To be fair we're already experiencing the beginnings of "Less tech people = more money"; the contract job I've just started hired me due to the "staffing adjustment" of some of their European coders. The result is £925 a day for me, which in east midlands UK is a very tasty morsel.
- osullivj 9y ago
  I've been hoping contract day rates would go up too. But 925 in the East Mids is amazing. I'm intruiged - would you mind emailing (see profile) some details?
  - drrob 9y ago
    I'll email you at the Spreadserve one in a bit.
- skydoo 9y ago
  May I talk to you to know about how can I find such opportunitiy? I am looking to move to London, and want to evaluate my options. May you email me: skfix at outlook.com
  - drrob 9y ago
    There are some specific circumstances surrounding what I'm doing, so consider £925 as an ultra-rare, not-in-any-way indicative dayrate. To be fair even in London that would be high, though I know some fintech consultants can get that and more. And legacy language guys. In summary I'm a SaaS guy, being used to replace 3 Europeans who aren't likely to be there long-term to continue to build the product beyond its initial launch. My (albeit extortionate) day rate is less than their 3 combined, so it made sense for the company. Right place right time for me. For colour, from your perspective: if you can get £500 a day in London that's not bad at all, up here in the East Midlands (I'm near Nottingham) I can get £350 to £400 a day, though I would normally trade some back for work flexibility (I prefer to work less than 8 hours a day).
    - 9y ago

blibble 9y ago

the only thing that is likely to halt is the unrestricted freedom of movement for EU workers the view amongst the UK electorate is not and has never been "all immigration is bad", surveys reveal that a majority of the UK electorate actually support an increase in migration of highly skilled workers they simply perceive unskilled migration to be a problem, and within the EU there is no ability to control it as a result: for the highly skilled from other parts of the world it will likely become easier and cheaper to migrate to the UK (and the government has been making noises to this effect)

arethuza 9y ago
'the view amongst the UK electorate is not and has never been "all immigration is bad"' So why the fascination with net migration figures and the desire by some elements to have "one in one out"? Edit: I do tend to worry that post Brexit there will be no reduction in net migration figures and there will be a resurgence of support for the far right who want to deliver on no immigration at all.
- TechnicalVault 9y ago
  I suspect that more of a press obsession with pretty graphs and dramatic pronouncements than actual public interest. Give the press something more interesting to talk about and it'll pretty soon leave the front page.
  - arethuza 9y ago
    Immigration was arguably the central topic for the Leave campaign and it was known to "resonate" very strongly with certain groups of voters. Not sure how you can argue that there is no "actual public interest" in the topic. See: "All Out War" by Tim Shipman for more on this - a really excellent book.
    - lhnz 9y ago
      The British public think a good trade deal with the EU is more important than cutting immigration when negotiating Brexit [0]. Remember that about 20% of the leavers are 'liberal leavers' - they are pro-migration. Once you add this group to the remainers it's clear that a minority of anti-immigration voters shouldn't decide politics for everybody else. [0] http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-people-want-a-soft-brexit-putting-the-economy-ahead-of-cutting-immigration-poll-a7363336.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-people...