6 ms·

> While speed may be the single most important element of a UI, there is plenty about GNOME that is going to disappoint Unity users. The biggest gripe I have is

> While speed may be the single most important element of a UI, there is plenty about GNOME that is going to disappoint Unity users. The biggest gripe I have is keyboard shortcuts. Unity had them in spades. For as graphical as Unity is/was, it was also very easy to drive without taking your hands off the keyboard. GNOME lacks that level of shortcuts. Can we please fix this before the convergence? Muscle memory and Linux go together like rosemary and garlic.

carussell 10y ago
Relatedly: making "safe" keybinding choices as an application developer has been a problem for a long time. Especially when compiz was the new hotness, many application shortcuts needed to be rebound by the end user, because the authors had chosen ones that were now in conflict, especially ones involving Ctrl and Alt together. Before that, Mozilla had gone through something with the Mozilla Suite, where seemingly every contributor wanted to ship their new feature with a keybinding for it, which meant there was an internal friction. But product leads and code reviewers were also burdened with respecting platform conventions, too. Eventually, there came a separate approval process for any proposed shortcut, with specific people tasked with managing allocations (and reclaiming past ones—this project management approach is what eventually led to Firefox). The headache persists, because there tends to be no pattern for the assignment of shortcuts. When Unity was introduced, I'd hoped that they'd seize the opportunity of a clean break to reconcile problem, but that didn't happen. Here is the scheme I've adopted: 1. If we pull back our scope a bit from the application, then operations on the window itself are performed with Super. (It helps that this key usually has Windows iconography on it). 2. Finally, if we pull all the way back, operations to be handled by the environment/desktop/graphical shell/what-have-you are performed with Alt+Super. The implication of 1 is that to move a window around without having to drag its title bar, you'd use Super along with a mousedown anywhere in the window, rather than Alt+mousedown. It also means that the shortcut to close the current window is not Alt+F4, but instead it can be remapped to Super+F4. Same goes with Alt+Tab, which becomes Super+Tab. This is jarring at first and perhaps controversial. But even when I wanted to abandon my own scheme because of how bothersome this stuff felt at first, I found that after one day of use, I had become accustomed to it. So switching is really not as bothersome as kneejerk might have you believe. Flipping between virtual desktops is Alt+Super+arrow rather than Ctrl+Alt+arrow (or other combinations that might be in use) and revealing the desktop by hiding all windows is Alt+Super+D. I have global launchers set up like this, too. E.g., Alt+Super+T brings up a new GNOME Terminal window. What this means is that any combination of Ctrl or Alt or Ctrl+Alt (along with Ctrl+Shift, Alt+Shift, and Ctrl+Alt+Shift) in the keybindspace are reserved for use by the application. Go wild. I put this scheme into place once whenever I buy a new machine or otherwise do a new system install, and then never have to worry about it again. The important thing to note that it entirely comes down to remapping the default "global" shortcuts so that the desktop/WM is not stomping on the application keybindspace. This is very easy—it doesn't involve trawling through dozens of apps' settings panels or config files so they comply; you remap the "global" desktop/WM shortcuts and you're done. The result of adopting a scheme like this is zero conflicts, ever, and you end up feeling like you have more space. It might sound so cumbersome as to be unworkable, but don't underestimate the advantages of what a clean break, once-and-for-all decision like this brings around.
jasonkostempski 10y ago
xfce (Xubuntu) hasn't unexpectedly changed on me in about 10 years. YMMV but I haven't been surprised once and haven't seen any features in other DEs I wish it had.
- NikolaeVarius 10y ago
  Agreed. Except for that horrible screen tearing.
  - andreyv 10y ago
    The git version of Xfwm4 fixes this.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - oridecon 10y ago
    Install Compton
  - jasonkostempski 10y ago
    As in the horrible screen tearing surprisingly went away? That's what happened for me. Is it still a common issue?
reacweb 10y ago
what are all those shortcuts ? AFAIK, you can customize gnome easily.
- 3pt14159 10y ago
  I feel like I'm being asked to list all the shortcuts I use, which seems impossible and I've never used Gnome, so I don't know what it's missing. But off the top of my head the must haves are: 1. Open a new terminal and max screen it with focus in the prompt, not on the "window". 2. Move windows between workspaces. 3. Screenshot with copy to clipboard. 4. Disable "quit all" for applications on an application-by-application basis (I never want to nuke chrome, but I often want to close all finder windows). 5. When plugged into a monitor, move active application to the monitor and have it show up correctly. If it was maximized or full screen, make it maximized or full screen in the new context and make sure to handle different pixel resolutions correctly. 6. Fullscreen toggle. 7. Maxscreen toggle. 8. Paste from clipboard without formatting. 9. Make capslock an additional control. 10. Remap individual control keys and have them work in all contexts and in all ways resemble those keys (something that Unity doesn't do which drives me insane in Slack in the browser where I can't always copy and paste because Slack somehow knows capslock isn't a "real" control).
- unethical_ban 10y ago
  3pt14159 put it well: There are more than a dozen really useful keyboard shortcuts for UI management, and tiling your windows. I mean, it's powerful - maybe one of the most standout features of Unity. You know what is really the icing on it? Hold down the "Super" key, and you get a menu showing all the UI keyboard shortcuts. It's a quick modal - no Alt-F1 help dialogs to navigate and close; no link to a website; a handy cheatsheet instantly accessible and dismissed. I'll give GNOME a try, but everything I hear is that it's a directionless blob that makes productivity difficult.
  - reacweb 10y ago
    In 2013, when I have first chosen gnome, it was to replace the PC of my old parents. I have contributed to a gnome extension (translated in french) https://bitbucket.org/LukasKnuth/backslide https://bitbucket.org/LukasKnuth/backslide to make it looks like their previous computer on windows XP. AFAIK, ubuntu gnome is very stripped down by default, but it is easy to tailor to fit many needs. The extensions are often written in javascript.
fulafel 10y ago
Unity really went overboard with it, and took over keys that applications had been using. Like Alt (!).
lobo_tuerto 10y ago
I replaced Unity with i3 and have been living happily ever after. https://i3wm.org/ https://i3wm.org/
- vivab0rg 10y ago
  +1 although an Ubuntu user since it's very first release, i3wm has been my go-to productivity DE for the last 5 years or so. Plus it's multiple-monitor support is superb, much more useful than Unity's
  - lobo_tuerto 10y ago
    Indeed, I have a dual monitor setup (horizontal + vertical) and it's been a joy to finally have independent control of each one of them. Hated that Unity treated them as a single desktop.

carussell 10y ago

Relatedly: making "safe" keybinding choices as an application developer has been a problem for a long time. Especially when compiz was the new hotness, many application shortcuts needed to be rebound by the end user, because the authors had chosen ones that were now in conflict, especially ones involving Ctrl and Alt together. Before that, Mozilla had gone through something with the Mozilla Suite, where seemingly every contributor wanted to ship their new feature with a keybinding for it, which meant there was an internal friction. But product leads and code reviewers were also burdened with respecting platform conventions, too. Eventually, there came a separate approval process for any proposed shortcut, with specific people tasked with managing allocations (and reclaiming past ones—this project management approach is what eventually led to Firefox). The headache persists, because there tends to be no pattern for the assignment of shortcuts. When Unity was introduced, I'd hoped that they'd seize the opportunity of a clean break to reconcile problem, but that didn't happen. Here is the scheme I've adopted: 1. If we pull back our scope a bit from the application, then operations on the window itself are performed with Super. (It helps that this key usually has Windows iconography on it). 2. Finally, if we pull all the way back, operations to be handled by the environment/desktop/graphical shell/what-have-you are performed with Alt+Super. The implication of 1 is that to move a window around without having to drag its title bar, you'd use Super along with a mousedown anywhere in the window, rather than Alt+mousedown. It also means that the shortcut to close the current window is not Alt+F4, but instead it can be remapped to Super+F4. Same goes with Alt+Tab, which becomes Super+Tab. This is jarring at first and perhaps controversial. But even when I wanted to abandon my own scheme because of how bothersome this stuff felt at first, I found that after one day of use, I had become accustomed to it. So switching is really not as bothersome as kneejerk might have you believe. Flipping between virtual desktops is Alt+Super+arrow rather than Ctrl+Alt+arrow (or other combinations that might be in use) and revealing the desktop by hiding all windows is Alt+Super+D. I have global launchers set up like this, too. E.g., Alt+Super+T brings up a new GNOME Terminal window. What this means is that any combination of Ctrl or Alt or Ctrl+Alt (along with Ctrl+Shift, Alt+Shift, and Ctrl+Alt+Shift) in the keybindspace are reserved for use by the application. Go wild. I put this scheme into place once whenever I buy a new machine or otherwise do a new system install, and then never have to worry about it again. The important thing to note that it entirely comes down to remapping the default "global" shortcuts so that the desktop/WM is not stomping on the application keybindspace. This is very easy—it doesn't involve trawling through dozens of apps' settings panels or config files so they comply; you remap the "global" desktop/WM shortcuts and you're done. The result of adopting a scheme like this is zero conflicts, ever, and you end up feeling like you have more space. It might sound so cumbersome as to be unworkable, but don't underestimate the advantages of what a clean break, once-and-for-all decision like this brings around.

jasonkostempski 10y ago

xfce (Xubuntu) hasn't unexpectedly changed on me in about 10 years. YMMV but I haven't been surprised once and haven't seen any features in other DEs I wish it had.

NikolaeVarius 10y ago
Agreed. Except for that horrible screen tearing.
- andreyv 10y ago
  The git version of Xfwm4 fixes this.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- oridecon 10y ago
  Install Compton
- jasonkostempski 10y ago
  As in the horrible screen tearing surprisingly went away? That's what happened for me. Is it still a common issue?

reacweb 10y ago

what are all those shortcuts ? AFAIK, you can customize gnome easily.

3pt14159 10y ago
I feel like I'm being asked to list all the shortcuts I use, which seems impossible and I've never used Gnome, so I don't know what it's missing. But off the top of my head the must haves are: 1. Open a new terminal and max screen it with focus in the prompt, not on the "window". 2. Move windows between workspaces. 3. Screenshot with copy to clipboard. 4. Disable "quit all" for applications on an application-by-application basis (I never want to nuke chrome, but I often want to close all finder windows). 5. When plugged into a monitor, move active application to the monitor and have it show up correctly. If it was maximized or full screen, make it maximized or full screen in the new context and make sure to handle different pixel resolutions correctly. 6. Fullscreen toggle. 7. Maxscreen toggle. 8. Paste from clipboard without formatting. 9. Make capslock an additional control. 10. Remap individual control keys and have them work in all contexts and in all ways resemble those keys (something that Unity doesn't do which drives me insane in Slack in the browser where I can't always copy and paste because Slack somehow knows capslock isn't a "real" control).
unethical_ban 10y ago
3pt14159 put it well: There are more than a dozen really useful keyboard shortcuts for UI management, and tiling your windows. I mean, it's powerful - maybe one of the most standout features of Unity. You know what is really the icing on it? Hold down the "Super" key, and you get a menu showing all the UI keyboard shortcuts. It's a quick modal - no Alt-F1 help dialogs to navigate and close; no link to a website; a handy cheatsheet instantly accessible and dismissed. I'll give GNOME a try, but everything I hear is that it's a directionless blob that makes productivity difficult.
- reacweb 10y ago
  In 2013, when I have first chosen gnome, it was to replace the PC of my old parents. I have contributed to a gnome extension (translated in french) https://bitbucket.org/LukasKnuth/backslide https://bitbucket.org/LukasKnuth/backslide to make it looks like their previous computer on windows XP. AFAIK, ubuntu gnome is very stripped down by default, but it is easy to tailor to fit many needs. The extensions are often written in javascript.

fulafel 10y ago

Unity really went overboard with it, and took over keys that applications had been using. Like Alt (!).

lobo_tuerto 10y ago

I replaced Unity with i3 and have been living happily ever after. https://i3wm.org/ https://i3wm.org/

vivab0rg 10y ago
+1 although an Ubuntu user since it's very first release, i3wm has been my go-to productivity DE for the last 5 years or so. Plus it's multiple-monitor support is superb, much more useful than Unity's
- lobo_tuerto 10y ago
  Indeed, I have a dual monitor setup (horizontal + vertical) and it's been a joy to finally have independent control of each one of them. Hated that Unity treated them as a single desktop.