2 ms·

Understanding that there are differences is one thing, knowing what they are is a whole other. Unless you know anything about those areas, you're still going to

Understanding that there are differences is one thing, knowing what they are is a whole other. Unless you know anything about those areas, you're still going to simply think "China". I'm not saying they'll refuse the idea of differences. Maybe this is a cultural thing, with Australians generally having better geographical understanding than Scandinavians? Up here in Scandinavia, China and USA are both just large countries. People of course know that the American states are different (they might even remember a few of the names), but unless they've been there or specifically studied the subject somehow, then they're not going to know how they differ. They might recognize Alabama due to Forest Gump or other movies, but won't necessarily understand a joke about cousins. They might associate Texas with a funny accent and cowboy movies. They'll know that Las Vegas is famous for casinos, but don't ask what state it's in. I happen to have a personal connection to China, but I can also guarantee you that most people will just give you a blank stare if you mention Xinjiang, guessing its location based on it sounding Chinese by their broken definition of what Chinese sounds like. They will have heard of Tibet, but won't know the dynamics between Tibet and mainland, or even Hong Kong and mainland. And, just for fun: The only thing I know about California off the top of my head would be that a few sorta successful IT companies have their headquarters there, and as a fellow developer, I assume that there at least has to be some sensible people there as a result. I also happen to know that they were primarily anti-Trump, but I would have to look it up to figure out what things California is famous for. To me, despite having been there, thorough knowledge of USA is simply not relevant information, so I only know about it if someone tells me or if I happen to look it up.

zild3d 10y ago
I think you are correct that most (Americans at least) don't know any cultural differences between Chinese cities unless they have a personal tie to knowing them, such as business or relationships. And yet I was still taken aback when you described how little you know about California. I had assumed being on a site like ycombinator, which is arguably the most famous startup incubator, based in sillicon valley, the most famous startup hub, that you would know many globally dominant companies (uber, google, apple, facebook, netflix, twitter, intel, adobe, etc, etc) are headquartered/founded there, not just a few sorta successful IT companies.
- arghwhat 10y ago
  Those were the companies I was referring to. I apologize if my sarcasm wasn't clear.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
skissane 10y ago
I would have thought most educated Australians understand the difference between "red states" and "blue states", and would identify California as a "blue state" and Alabama and Tennessee as "red states". (The "red state"/"blue state" terminology only dates to the 2000 election, but the reality it refers to is older than the label.) California is on average politically much more left-leaning than Alabama/Tennessee, and on average significantly less religious. And the difference between a West Coast accent and a Southern accent. Obviously that kind of mental model of the US is simplifying a lot of things, but it does accurately identify some real differences in US culture. I am university-educated, and so are most of my family and friends, so I'd imagine less educated people may on average have a simpler mental model of the US. If you watch Australian TV news, there is frequest coverage of US national politics (regular but shallow on the commercial networks, serious and in-depth on public broadcasting), so I don't think it is uncommon for Australians to acquire this sort of basic understanding of the US. Even people who don't watch the TV news or read the newspaper are likely to watch a lot of US TV shows and movies, and so tend to acquire a basic (if simplistic and distorted) understanding of US culture through that. Maybe there is less coverage of the US in the Scandinavian media? Australia is probably more influenced by the US than the global average, although I thought US media exports were popular in most countries on earth, and US politics arguably gets more international coverage than the politics of any other country. > They will have heard of Tibet, but won't know the dynamics between Tibet and mainland, or even Hong Kong and mainland. I would have thought most educated people would know at least a little bit about the dynamics between Tibet and the Chinese government. Again, I don't know what is in the news in Scandinavia, but there have for years been frequent stories in Australian media about the conflict between the Dalai Lama and Beijing–every time the Dalai Lama visits Australia (he's been here several times), Beijing complains about his visit, and the possibility that he might meet Australian politicans, and the controversy is reported in the media. Sympathy for the cause of Tibetan independence is common (although certainly not universal) in Australia, and I thought that was true of the US as well. Even people whose media consumption is much more low-brow than mine would probably remember Richard Gere's outspoken support for it. The conflict between Beijing and the Uighurs in Xinjiang gets global media coverage too, so I'd expect a lot of people have at least heard of it, although it hasn't impacted the popular consciousness to anywhere near the same degree as the Tibet issue has. In 2009, Uighur activist Rebiya Kadeer visited Australia, and the Chinese government got very upset over the whole thing, and that led to extensive coverage in the Australian media. (She's come back again since, but subsequent visits didn't receive the same attention; most people probably couldn't remember her name, I myself had forgotten it, but I remembered the furore.) I can remember Australian media coverage of the Hong Kong democracy movement from pre-handover times to today. The umbrella protest movement of 2014 received extensive media coverage in Australia. Possibly China gets less news coverage in the US or Scandinavia than Australia, so it may well be true that the average American or Scandinavian knows less about China than the average Australian does.

zild3d 10y ago

I think you are correct that most (Americans at least) don't know any cultural differences between Chinese cities unless they have a personal tie to knowing them, such as business or relationships. And yet I was still taken aback when you described how little you know about California. I had assumed being on a site like ycombinator, which is arguably the most famous startup incubator, based in sillicon valley, the most famous startup hub, that you would know many globally dominant companies (uber, google, apple, facebook, netflix, twitter, intel, adobe, etc, etc) are headquartered/founded there, not just a few sorta successful IT companies.

arghwhat 10y ago
Those were the companies I was referring to. I apologize if my sarcasm wasn't clear.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

skissane 10y ago

I would have thought most educated Australians understand the difference between "red states" and "blue states", and would identify California as a "blue state" and Alabama and Tennessee as "red states". (The "red state"/"blue state" terminology only dates to the 2000 election, but the reality it refers to is older than the label.) California is on average politically much more left-leaning than Alabama/Tennessee, and on average significantly less religious. And the difference between a West Coast accent and a Southern accent. Obviously that kind of mental model of the US is simplifying a lot of things, but it does accurately identify some real differences in US culture. I am university-educated, and so are most of my family and friends, so I'd imagine less educated people may on average have a simpler mental model of the US. If you watch Australian TV news, there is frequest coverage of US national politics (regular but shallow on the commercial networks, serious and in-depth on public broadcasting), so I don't think it is uncommon for Australians to acquire this sort of basic understanding of the US. Even people who don't watch the TV news or read the newspaper are likely to watch a lot of US TV shows and movies, and so tend to acquire a basic (if simplistic and distorted) understanding of US culture through that. Maybe there is less coverage of the US in the Scandinavian media? Australia is probably more influenced by the US than the global average, although I thought US media exports were popular in most countries on earth, and US politics arguably gets more international coverage than the politics of any other country. > They will have heard of Tibet, but won't know the dynamics between Tibet and mainland, or even Hong Kong and mainland. I would have thought most educated people would know at least a little bit about the dynamics between Tibet and the Chinese government. Again, I don't know what is in the news in Scandinavia, but there have for years been frequent stories in Australian media about the conflict between the Dalai Lama and Beijing–every time the Dalai Lama visits Australia (he's been here several times), Beijing complains about his visit, and the possibility that he might meet Australian politicans, and the controversy is reported in the media. Sympathy for the cause of Tibetan independence is common (although certainly not universal) in Australia, and I thought that was true of the US as well. Even people whose media consumption is much more low-brow than mine would probably remember Richard Gere's outspoken support for it. The conflict between Beijing and the Uighurs in Xinjiang gets global media coverage too, so I'd expect a lot of people have at least heard of it, although it hasn't impacted the popular consciousness to anywhere near the same degree as the Tibet issue has. In 2009, Uighur activist Rebiya Kadeer visited Australia, and the Chinese government got very upset over the whole thing, and that led to extensive coverage in the Australian media. (She's come back again since, but subsequent visits didn't receive the same attention; most people probably couldn't remember her name, I myself had forgotten it, but I remembered the furore.) I can remember Australian media coverage of the Hong Kong democracy movement from pre-handover times to today. The umbrella protest movement of 2014 received extensive media coverage in Australia. Possibly China gets less news coverage in the US or Scandinavia than Australia, so it may well be true that the average American or Scandinavian knows less about China than the average Australian does.