4 ms·

Have you read the article? It's not the pen. It's high quality steel. I think most countries probably still cannot do it now. China just successfully flew a big

Have you read the article? It's not the pen. It's high quality steel. I think most countries probably still cannot do it now. China just successfully flew a big plane a few days ago (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comac_C919 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comac_C919) and could automate package delivery like this https://twitter.com/kerotto/status/851055016928460800 https://twitter.com/kerotto/status/851055016928460800 There are many important areas where it has already been the leader of world (high speed trains, consumer software apps, etc)

lacampbell 9y ago
China has built passenger airlines many times before, none of them have ever taken off in international markets. When the C919 is used regularly outside China I'll take note. How is China the leader of the world in high speed trains? They're all based off of designs from Japan and Germany. China is only the leader in consumer software apps inside of China, and only then because it outright bans foreign competition. The fact is China is the worlds most populous country but leads the world in absolutely nothing. And please be clear - this is not a criticism of the Chinese people - of course they have the capacity. But central planning and top down directives will never lead to world beating results.
- tchaffee 9y ago
  Leads the world in absolutely nothing... #1 manufacturer in the world.
  - myrandomcomment 9y ago
    So? The labor was cheap. And the rules were, shall we say flexible. The US was number one. The rules came, the cost went up and it moved. Look at my other post. One of the startups I worked at moved out of China because of the cost got to high. Its a cycle. As they become more open, more western and more regulated it will change again.
    - tchaffee 9y ago
      Parent post claims China leads the world in nothing. Which is clearly wrong. No need to go beyond that.
      - myrandomcomment 9y ago
        Reply was to: tchaffee 2 hours ago [-] "Leads the world in absolutely nothing... #1 manufacturer in the world." Which was correct. I think you got it wrong.
        tchaffee 9y ago
        I don't think I got it wrong. My point was only to correct the original claim that China leads the world in absolutely nothing. If you're not impressed with China being #1 at one of the most important economic sectors in the world, and you want to explain it away, then carry on. I'm not super interested in that convo because I do lots of business with China and already understand the situation intimately and have far better resources than HN comments for learning what's actually happening there. Not meant to be mean spirited, I'm just not interested unless you do business there and have contacts there up to the highest levels of government in which case, let's talk and I might even pay for good info.
        myrandomcomment 9y ago
        Ran Asia for my last 2 startups. I know what I am talking about. I do 120k miles a year from SFO to around Asia. I can read ~1000 Hànzi. My comment was that they are number #1 because of timing and place in their development cycle and it like everything is subject to change. It is really that simple. I wish them all the luck.
        tchaffee 9y ago
        Of course it's a fair point to say things will change... I just wouldn't write off their accomplishment of #1 as simply or only timing and place. There are many factors, and it's also accurate to say the Chinese are actually better than the rest of the world at some things.
  - lacampbell 9y ago
    Sure, it also leads the world in "having the most people". But that's not what I was getting at. What things does it manufacture or do better than anyone else?
    - tchaffee 9y ago
      Whether it impresses you or not, they are #1.
      - lacampbell 9y ago
        The context of this discussion is can china transition to high value manufacturing, and I don't think it can because despite the worlds largest population, it still struggles to produce things smaller countries are capable of. #1 manufacturer is entirely due to a huge population and low costs - both advantages are disappearing. What unique way forward does China have? Another 5 year plan?
        tchaffee 9y ago
        India has the 2nd largest population. By your reasoning, they should also be huge at manufacturing. It's not just China's population that enabled them to overtake the USA at manufacturing. Average IQ is 105. Underestimate if you'd like. My family on the other hand will continue to do business with them because they have a lot to bring to the table.
        lacampbell 9y ago
        India has the 2nd largest population. By your reasoning, they should also be huge at manufacturing. It's not just China's population that enabled them to overtake the USA at manufacturing. Population and low cost are the two biggest reasons China has overtaken the US. There's nothing miraculous about Chinas position in the global economy - it's a huge country. If anything, it still underperforms. Much smaller nations are producing passenger aircraft and automobiles used all over the world. Average IQ is 105. Which just goes to show you the disastrous effects of socialism, even though it's been curtailed. A high IQ nation with no wars - it should by all rights be a first world country like its eastern neighbours, or indeed - like its Special Administrative Regions. My family on the other hand will continue to do business with them because they have a lot to bring to the table. Why would my thoughts on the economic outlook huge nation of over a billion affect who I do business with? Why would I assume a Chinese business or individual has nothing to bring to the table? The fact I don't think I'll be taking international flights on a Chinese made jet any time soon doesn't really affect my view of things like business relationships.

lacampbell 9y ago

China has built passenger airlines many times before, none of them have ever taken off in international markets. When the C919 is used regularly outside China I'll take note. How is China the leader of the world in high speed trains? They're all based off of designs from Japan and Germany. China is only the leader in consumer software apps inside of China, and only then because it outright bans foreign competition. The fact is China is the worlds most populous country but leads the world in absolutely nothing. And please be clear - this is not a criticism of the Chinese people - of course they have the capacity. But central planning and top down directives will never lead to world beating results.

tchaffee 9y ago
Leads the world in absolutely nothing... #1 manufacturer in the world.
- myrandomcomment 9y ago
  So? The labor was cheap. And the rules were, shall we say flexible. The US was number one. The rules came, the cost went up and it moved. Look at my other post. One of the startups I worked at moved out of China because of the cost got to high. Its a cycle. As they become more open, more western and more regulated it will change again.
  - tchaffee 9y ago
    Parent post claims China leads the world in nothing. Which is clearly wrong. No need to go beyond that.
    - myrandomcomment 9y ago
      Reply was to: tchaffee 2 hours ago [-] "Leads the world in absolutely nothing... #1 manufacturer in the world." Which was correct. I think you got it wrong.
      - tchaffee 9y ago
        I don't think I got it wrong. My point was only to correct the original claim that China leads the world in absolutely nothing. If you're not impressed with China being #1 at one of the most important economic sectors in the world, and you want to explain it away, then carry on. I'm not super interested in that convo because I do lots of business with China and already understand the situation intimately and have far better resources than HN comments for learning what's actually happening there. Not meant to be mean spirited, I'm just not interested unless you do business there and have contacts there up to the highest levels of government in which case, let's talk and I might even pay for good info.
        myrandomcomment 9y ago
        Ran Asia for my last 2 startups. I know what I am talking about. I do 120k miles a year from SFO to around Asia. I can read ~1000 Hànzi. My comment was that they are number #1 because of timing and place in their development cycle and it like everything is subject to change. It is really that simple. I wish them all the luck.
        tchaffee 9y ago
        Of course it's a fair point to say things will change... I just wouldn't write off their accomplishment of #1 as simply or only timing and place. There are many factors, and it's also accurate to say the Chinese are actually better than the rest of the world at some things.
- lacampbell 9y ago
  Sure, it also leads the world in "having the most people". But that's not what I was getting at. What things does it manufacture or do better than anyone else?
  - tchaffee 9y ago
    Whether it impresses you or not, they are #1.
    - lacampbell 9y ago
      The context of this discussion is can china transition to high value manufacturing, and I don't think it can because despite the worlds largest population, it still struggles to produce things smaller countries are capable of. #1 manufacturer is entirely due to a huge population and low costs - both advantages are disappearing. What unique way forward does China have? Another 5 year plan?
      - tchaffee 9y ago
        India has the 2nd largest population. By your reasoning, they should also be huge at manufacturing. It's not just China's population that enabled them to overtake the USA at manufacturing. Average IQ is 105. Underestimate if you'd like. My family on the other hand will continue to do business with them because they have a lot to bring to the table.
        lacampbell 9y ago
        India has the 2nd largest population. By your reasoning, they should also be huge at manufacturing. It's not just China's population that enabled them to overtake the USA at manufacturing. Population and low cost are the two biggest reasons China has overtaken the US. There's nothing miraculous about Chinas position in the global economy - it's a huge country. If anything, it still underperforms. Much smaller nations are producing passenger aircraft and automobiles used all over the world. Average IQ is 105. Which just goes to show you the disastrous effects of socialism, even though it's been curtailed. A high IQ nation with no wars - it should by all rights be a first world country like its eastern neighbours, or indeed - like its Special Administrative Regions. My family on the other hand will continue to do business with them because they have a lot to bring to the table. Why would my thoughts on the economic outlook huge nation of over a billion affect who I do business with? Why would I assume a Chinese business or individual has nothing to bring to the table? The fact I don't think I'll be taking international flights on a Chinese made jet any time soon doesn't really affect my view of things like business relationships.