5 ms·

And why is that a surprise ? The public schooling in USA has widely distorted the housing market creating ghettos where similar people will get clubbed together

by tn135 9y ago

And why is that a surprise ? The public schooling in USA has widely distorted the housing market creating ghettos where similar people will get clubbed together.

xeromal 9y ago
Would you mind telling me what state you are from? I have a curiosity I need to satisfy.
- tn135 9y ago
  California. Without looking into any statistics I can bet that Asian dominated Santa Clara will have much higher life expectancy than Alameda which has different racial profile mostly with low wage (H1Bs etc) Asian population. Merced which is highly Hispanic will be scraping the bottom. NOW let me check the stats : Santa Clara : 80.6 Alameda : 78.8 Merced :75.8
wil421 9y ago
How is this a US problem? Everywhere I've ever visited, and I've been to as many countries as I have States, has quote on quote: "Widely distorted the housing market creating ghettos where similar people will get clubbed together." I think they call them neighborhoods. Rich people live in nicer houses than other people. Pretty sure it's been like this since one caveman had a bigger cave with bigger rocks to throw. Sacasim aside I really think we need a national school system. In Georgia it varies by counties. Some counties compete on a national level others are dead last in the nation, if we aren't counting Mississippi.
- ghaff 9y ago
  You can certainly have flat spending per pupil independent of location. Which means that many inner city school districts get less money than they do today and many affluent suburbs get more.
- tn135 9y ago
  > How is this a US problem? One word: Mobility. I lived in a slum in India and went to a private school that catered to poor kids. Got scholarship and worked my way up to start living into a high-rise. The private school had a big role to play in it. That is not possible for low income neighbourhoods for USA anymore. The mindless regulations make private schools expensive. It is not possible for a retired school teacher to run a class-room in a garage at night and call it a school. That teacher will end up in jail and sex offenders registry. The poor hispanic neighbourhoods of south San Jose will have to rely on the pathetic public schools and those schools will ensure their students flip burgers. Those kids will find it hard to move to Palo Alto. Public schools not only distort the housing markets but they feed into that evil spiral of poverty. I would love to see department of education dismantled completely and money given to kids to chose their schools of choice and let entrepreneurs make money by catering to the needs of all kids.
  - wil421 9y ago
    India is/was a socialist state and I would expect social services to be spread more evenly than non-socialist countries. I also believe mobility is easier in developing nations and was better to some extent right after the Industrial Revolution and workers rights movements. I am confused by your arguments. You're saying abolish public schools. Great idea then we could create pillar schools where only the elites attend like Yale and Harvard. Then the poor people will have to take out loans from the elite to attend good High Schools. Oh wait. I'm a product of mobility. My father grew up in rural government housing in Georgia. Thankfully he went to GaTech and stayed in an environment with good public schools.
    - chimeracoder 9y ago
      > India is/was a socialist state and I would expect social services to be spread more evenly than non-socialist countries. I also believe mobility is easier in developing nations and was better to some extent right after the Industrial Revolution and workers rights movements. Saying "India is a socialist state" is, well, technically correct (it's in the Constitution) but a pretty misleading way to characterize the sort of social mobility in India that GP was talking about. India is home to the longest-running continuously-serving democratically elected Communist government in the entire world. It's also home to what could be considered borderline anarcho-capitalist metropolises that are larger than many European countries. As it turns out, the sort of mobility that GP is talking about is very rare in the states led by Communist and socialist parties, which have generally struggled economically[0]. It's most prevalent in the states (and cities) where the leftist governments never took hold, or where they were elected, but carried out very little of their vision in practice. In any case, the scale of mobility and economic growth experienced in the economic hotspots of India (Delhi, Mumbai, Bangalore) has been made possible by the end of imperial colonialism, and the concurrent rise of a global economy. No developed country like the US will ever be able to experience that same level of rapid growth. [0] There is one exception, though in that state, 33% of the state's GDP comes from foreign remittances (mostly from expatriates living in the Gulf), which is incredibly high, and higher than any other state. There is definitely an object-lesson in mobility to be learned there, but it's not the sort of mobility GP was referring to.
alkonaut 9y ago
The problem is local funding for schooling I think. If funding was state level or federal and funds would be allocated to schools that need it - I.e. schools with poor students (less help from home, perhaps language issues) will be given a lot more funding per student. Without this, what happens is that affluent people move to good school districts. These districts then get students with better academic backgrounds, fewer parents with drug/legal problems, fewer students with lanugage problems. Its pretty obvious to be a system that spirals out of control in just a few generations, creating segregated patches. But perhaps this is how the support for the public school system is upheld? Rich people accept the system, because they can game it? If that's the case then it might be a necessary evil. Politically viable alternatives such as voucher systems will create the same effect (I know from experience).
- tn135 9y ago
  > would be allocated to schools that need it - I.e. schools with poor students That will serve an incentive for the school to actually ensure students get bad grades.

by tn135 9y ago

And why is that a surprise ? The public schooling in USA has widely distorted the housing market creating ghettos where similar people will get clubbed together.

xeromal 9y ago

Would you mind telling me what state you are from? I have a curiosity I need to satisfy.

tn135 9y ago
California. Without looking into any statistics I can bet that Asian dominated Santa Clara will have much higher life expectancy than Alameda which has different racial profile mostly with low wage (H1Bs etc) Asian population. Merced which is highly Hispanic will be scraping the bottom. NOW let me check the stats : Santa Clara : 80.6 Alameda : 78.8 Merced :75.8

wil421 9y ago

How is this a US problem? Everywhere I've ever visited, and I've been to as many countries as I have States, has quote on quote: "Widely distorted the housing market creating ghettos where similar people will get clubbed together." I think they call them neighborhoods. Rich people live in nicer houses than other people. Pretty sure it's been like this since one caveman had a bigger cave with bigger rocks to throw. Sacasim aside I really think we need a national school system. In Georgia it varies by counties. Some counties compete on a national level others are dead last in the nation, if we aren't counting Mississippi.

ghaff 9y ago
You can certainly have flat spending per pupil independent of location. Which means that many inner city school districts get less money than they do today and many affluent suburbs get more.
tn135 9y ago
> How is this a US problem? One word: Mobility. I lived in a slum in India and went to a private school that catered to poor kids. Got scholarship and worked my way up to start living into a high-rise. The private school had a big role to play in it. That is not possible for low income neighbourhoods for USA anymore. The mindless regulations make private schools expensive. It is not possible for a retired school teacher to run a class-room in a garage at night and call it a school. That teacher will end up in jail and sex offenders registry. The poor hispanic neighbourhoods of south San Jose will have to rely on the pathetic public schools and those schools will ensure their students flip burgers. Those kids will find it hard to move to Palo Alto. Public schools not only distort the housing markets but they feed into that evil spiral of poverty. I would love to see department of education dismantled completely and money given to kids to chose their schools of choice and let entrepreneurs make money by catering to the needs of all kids.
- wil421 9y ago
  India is/was a socialist state and I would expect social services to be spread more evenly than non-socialist countries. I also believe mobility is easier in developing nations and was better to some extent right after the Industrial Revolution and workers rights movements. I am confused by your arguments. You're saying abolish public schools. Great idea then we could create pillar schools where only the elites attend like Yale and Harvard. Then the poor people will have to take out loans from the elite to attend good High Schools. Oh wait. I'm a product of mobility. My father grew up in rural government housing in Georgia. Thankfully he went to GaTech and stayed in an environment with good public schools.
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > India is/was a socialist state and I would expect social services to be spread more evenly than non-socialist countries. I also believe mobility is easier in developing nations and was better to some extent right after the Industrial Revolution and workers rights movements. Saying "India is a socialist state" is, well, technically correct (it's in the Constitution) but a pretty misleading way to characterize the sort of social mobility in India that GP was talking about. India is home to the longest-running continuously-serving democratically elected Communist government in the entire world. It's also home to what could be considered borderline anarcho-capitalist metropolises that are larger than many European countries. As it turns out, the sort of mobility that GP is talking about is very rare in the states led by Communist and socialist parties, which have generally struggled economically[0]. It's most prevalent in the states (and cities) where the leftist governments never took hold, or where they were elected, but carried out very little of their vision in practice. In any case, the scale of mobility and economic growth experienced in the economic hotspots of India (Delhi, Mumbai, Bangalore) has been made possible by the end of imperial colonialism, and the concurrent rise of a global economy. No developed country like the US will ever be able to experience that same level of rapid growth. [0] There is one exception, though in that state, 33% of the state's GDP comes from foreign remittances (mostly from expatriates living in the Gulf), which is incredibly high, and higher than any other state. There is definitely an object-lesson in mobility to be learned there, but it's not the sort of mobility GP was referring to.

alkonaut 9y ago

The problem is local funding for schooling I think. If funding was state level or federal and funds would be allocated to schools that need it - I.e. schools with poor students (less help from home, perhaps language issues) will be given a lot more funding per student. Without this, what happens is that affluent people move to good school districts. These districts then get students with better academic backgrounds, fewer parents with drug/legal problems, fewer students with lanugage problems. Its pretty obvious to be a system that spirals out of control in just a few generations, creating segregated patches. But perhaps this is how the support for the public school system is upheld? Rich people accept the system, because they can game it? If that's the case then it might be a necessary evil. Politically viable alternatives such as voucher systems will create the same effect (I know from experience).

tn135 9y ago
> would be allocated to schools that need it - I.e. schools with poor students That will serve an incentive for the school to actually ensure students get bad grades.