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> Being committed to staying married when there are better alternatives might keep you married, but at what cost? The evidence shows, on average, divorcees end

> Being committed to staying married when there are better alternatives might keep you married, but at what cost? The evidence shows, on average, divorcees end up poorer and less happy than couples who stick together through tough times. The evidence shows, again on average, the children of divorcees are worse off. The problem is people are amazing at self-deception. They are terrible judges as to whether they are going to be happier/better off post-divorce. I don't have all the answers. But its clear that sticking together is more often than not the right strategy.

kelnos 9y ago
> The evidence shows, on average, divorcees end up poorer and less happy than couples who stick together through tough times. How do you even measure the latter bit? Happiness is entirely based on self-reporting, and a divorcee can't say "I would have been happier had I stayed together", because they literally cannot know that. Likewise, someone who stuck it out can't say "I would have ended up less happy had we broken up", because, again, that's unknowable. They can guess, and of course people will want to believe they made the right choice sticking it out, so I could see why they'd report greater happiness. I think your point about people being great at self-deception cuts both ways: they may not be able to accurately predict whether or not a divorce will make them happy in the future, but they're also likely to rationalize the decision to stay as being better when they have no real basis in doing so. Regarding poorness and: > The evidence shows, again on average, the children of divorcees are worse off. I think it's worthwhile examining why that is the case. It's telling that we say that people who have divorced have "failed" marriages. It's a negative. It creates shame, and people feel pressured, due to religion or other social reasons, to stay together. Could it not be that people end up poorer and children end of worse off after a divorce mainly because we as a society do not have the proper support structures in place to keep divorcees from experiencing negative outcomes? And hell, a decent amount of the "poorer" bit could be ascribed to the cost of the divorce itself, including court fees, lawyers, etc. Alimony also ends up being "inefficient": a friend of mine got divorced a few years ago and was required to pay alimony to his former spouse. The end result was the the money was not enough to bring her up to her standard of living during marriage, and the expense on his side was enough to drag his standard of living down as well. As an aside, do you have any references that support your claims? I'm very interested in reading them.
- sheepmullet 9y ago
  > How do you even measure the latter bit? Basically they look at people who are going through marital problems and collect self reported happiness levels then follow up a few years later and collect self reported happiness levels again. Some of those couples will have divorced. Some will still be together. There are certainly issues with these studies but overall they paint a pretty clear picture. > It creates shame, and people feel pressured, due to religion or other social reasons, to stay together. I don't think there is a lot of evidence for this view. The high rate of divorce indicates to me there isn't much of a stigma at all. And there are plenty of sources extolling the benefits of divorce. > And hell, a decent amount of the "poorer" bit could be ascribed to the cost of the divorce itself, It could be. Why should divorce costs should be excluded? > As an aside, do you have any references that support your claims? I haven't looked at these studies in years but I'll see if I can dig them up.

kelnos 9y ago

> The evidence shows, on average, divorcees end up poorer and less happy than couples who stick together through tough times. How do you even measure the latter bit? Happiness is entirely based on self-reporting, and a divorcee can't say "I would have been happier had I stayed together", because they literally cannot know that. Likewise, someone who stuck it out can't say "I would have ended up less happy had we broken up", because, again, that's unknowable. They can guess, and of course people will want to believe they made the right choice sticking it out, so I could see why they'd report greater happiness. I think your point about people being great at self-deception cuts both ways: they may not be able to accurately predict whether or not a divorce will make them happy in the future, but they're also likely to rationalize the decision to stay as being better when they have no real basis in doing so. Regarding poorness and: > The evidence shows, again on average, the children of divorcees are worse off. I think it's worthwhile examining why that is the case. It's telling that we say that people who have divorced have "failed" marriages. It's a negative. It creates shame, and people feel pressured, due to religion or other social reasons, to stay together. Could it not be that people end up poorer and children end of worse off after a divorce mainly because we as a society do not have the proper support structures in place to keep divorcees from experiencing negative outcomes? And hell, a decent amount of the "poorer" bit could be ascribed to the cost of the divorce itself, including court fees, lawyers, etc. Alimony also ends up being "inefficient": a friend of mine got divorced a few years ago and was required to pay alimony to his former spouse. The end result was the the money was not enough to bring her up to her standard of living during marriage, and the expense on his side was enough to drag his standard of living down as well. As an aside, do you have any references that support your claims? I'm very interested in reading them.

sheepmullet 9y ago
> How do you even measure the latter bit? Basically they look at people who are going through marital problems and collect self reported happiness levels then follow up a few years later and collect self reported happiness levels again. Some of those couples will have divorced. Some will still be together. There are certainly issues with these studies but overall they paint a pretty clear picture. > It creates shame, and people feel pressured, due to religion or other social reasons, to stay together. I don't think there is a lot of evidence for this view. The high rate of divorce indicates to me there isn't much of a stigma at all. And there are plenty of sources extolling the benefits of divorce. > And hell, a decent amount of the "poorer" bit could be ascribed to the cost of the divorce itself, It could be. Why should divorce costs should be excluded? > As an aside, do you have any references that support your claims? I haven't looked at these studies in years but I'll see if I can dig them up.