5 ms·

You can have different interpretation of the data. COST of a normal break up vs cost of a divorce. There is a huge difference of financial outcomes of a break

You can have different interpretation of the data. COST of a normal break up vs cost of a divorce. There is a huge difference of financial outcomes of a break up between a 7 month relationship and a 7 year marriage. For the 7 months relationship the couple moves on, and no financial re-arrangements happens. For the marriage, there is a much higher chance that the woman: 1) takes custody of the children (if the couple has them) 2) is recipient of child support 3) is recipient of alimony payments You can say that a "divorce" is much more costly to men and hence they are more likeley to stick it out a relationship or try to make it work, but there is less cost to women (financially at least), hence they are more likely to initiate it. Given the current marriage laws are a remnant of the 50s and 60s lifestyle (of women staying home, and needing financial protection in case of divorce), you can argue that the current law framework in the US encourages the initiation of the divorce from women, and discourages that from men. Since no divorce costs are involved in a normal 7 months long relationship, you see men initiating breakups just as much as women. TLDR: Current divorce laws favors women by a long shot, hence they are more likely to initiate it.

zzalpha 9y ago
You can have different interpretation of the data. COST of a normal break up vs cost of a divorce. As I said in my other post, I could considered that. But the study diminishes the likelihood of that interpretation. Married men initiate divorce less and report higher relationship satisfaction than women, while unmarried men and women report the same levels of relationship satisfaction. If men initiated divorce less simply because of the cost of divorce, that data does not make sense. You'd expect the same or lower satisfaction than women, but that's not borne out in the data.
- sheepmullet 9y ago
  > You'd expect the same or lower satisfaction than women, but that's not borne out in the data. Why would you expect that? Having options often decreases satisfaction. If you have a good job that has a few frustrating downsides which situation would make you more satisfied? A) You know all the alternative jobs are a lot worse. Better to try and improve the few frustrating bits. B) You are constantly informed about other great job alternatives. And you know you get to keep a lot of the benefits of the first job if you do change. Most often people in situation A will be more satisfied.
  - zzalpha 9y ago
    Err, yours is an argument for men and women both having lower relationship satisfaction in marriage as compared to unmarried couples. But you argument doesn't explain why married men and women have different levels, and definitely doesn't explain why men report higher levels than women.
    - sheepmullet 9y ago
      Sorry I have re-worded my comment a bit. Does it make sense now?
      - zzalpha 9y ago
        So your argument is that because women can get out of a marriage easier due to lower cost, they will report lower satisfaction due to a grass-is-greener effect. Interesting! Sounds like a theory worth exploring, definitely.
        sheepmullet 9y ago
        Exactly! It happens all the time in the workplace. I can't see any good reason why it wouldn't apply to relationships as well.
    - watwut 9y ago
      Statistically, men and women tend to have different expectations about marriage. Thing like whose career will be the more important one, who will do child related work (all those drop offs and pick ups that take time during work day, talking with teachers etc). If you love your job, do a lot of overtime and are happy with familly, the spouse might be increasingly unhappy without you knowing (no matter which gender is on which side). These things matter less when you don't have children and one of you did not moved where other one has job. Meaning, they are more likely to hit married people.
- zone411 9y ago
  You're making multiple unsupported assumptions and simplifications in these couple sentences that might not hold, so your conclusion becomes invalid. One example: the age of people in marriages compared to people in unmarried relations will be different and with it a variety of variables, such as the presence of kids. Another: single women are more interested in marriage than single men, so there could be even more differences between married/unmarried couples. Or let's take cheating - I could be completely satisfied throughout 99% of the duration of the relationship until the point when cheating occurred. Or we know that women are more likely to divorce men earning less than them or stay-at-home dads and the earning power of men and women in marriages changes as compared to unmarried men and women. Etc, etc. Social science gets very messy very quickly.
watwut 9y ago
Alimony applies only if she was stay at home. If both of you work full time, divorce law won't require you to pay alimony.
- kelnos 9y ago
  Depends on where you are. That's not true in California; there's a lot of flexibility in deciding that here. For example, if the separation will mean that one of the two parties will have to reduce their standard of living below that of what was enjoyed during the marriage, that can result in alimony payments. See http://www.cadivorce.com/california-divorce-guide/spousal-support/how-spousal-support-is-decided-in-california/ http://www.cadivorce.com/california-divorce-guide/spousal-su... for more fun on this topic.
ash 9y ago
Be careful with generalisations. The laws could differ a lot in different countries and even in different states in the US. See the "Real World Divorce" book for details: http://www.realworlddivorce.com http://www.realworlddivorce.com As far as I remember from reading the book, the law favors the spouse with the lower income among the two; and the spouse with child custody.

zzalpha 9y ago

You can have different interpretation of the data. COST of a normal break up vs cost of a divorce. As I said in my other post, I could considered that. But the study diminishes the likelihood of that interpretation. Married men initiate divorce less and report higher relationship satisfaction than women, while unmarried men and women report the same levels of relationship satisfaction. If men initiated divorce less simply because of the cost of divorce, that data does not make sense. You'd expect the same or lower satisfaction than women, but that's not borne out in the data.

sheepmullet 9y ago
> You'd expect the same or lower satisfaction than women, but that's not borne out in the data. Why would you expect that? Having options often decreases satisfaction. If you have a good job that has a few frustrating downsides which situation would make you more satisfied? A) You know all the alternative jobs are a lot worse. Better to try and improve the few frustrating bits. B) You are constantly informed about other great job alternatives. And you know you get to keep a lot of the benefits of the first job if you do change. Most often people in situation A will be more satisfied.
- zzalpha 9y ago
  Err, yours is an argument for men and women both having lower relationship satisfaction in marriage as compared to unmarried couples. But you argument doesn't explain why married men and women have different levels, and definitely doesn't explain why men report higher levels than women.
  - sheepmullet 9y ago
    Sorry I have re-worded my comment a bit. Does it make sense now?
    - zzalpha 9y ago
      So your argument is that because women can get out of a marriage easier due to lower cost, they will report lower satisfaction due to a grass-is-greener effect. Interesting! Sounds like a theory worth exploring, definitely.
      - sheepmullet 9y ago
        Exactly! It happens all the time in the workplace. I can't see any good reason why it wouldn't apply to relationships as well.
  - watwut 9y ago
    Statistically, men and women tend to have different expectations about marriage. Thing like whose career will be the more important one, who will do child related work (all those drop offs and pick ups that take time during work day, talking with teachers etc). If you love your job, do a lot of overtime and are happy with familly, the spouse might be increasingly unhappy without you knowing (no matter which gender is on which side). These things matter less when you don't have children and one of you did not moved where other one has job. Meaning, they are more likely to hit married people.
zone411 9y ago
You're making multiple unsupported assumptions and simplifications in these couple sentences that might not hold, so your conclusion becomes invalid. One example: the age of people in marriages compared to people in unmarried relations will be different and with it a variety of variables, such as the presence of kids. Another: single women are more interested in marriage than single men, so there could be even more differences between married/unmarried couples. Or let's take cheating - I could be completely satisfied throughout 99% of the duration of the relationship until the point when cheating occurred. Or we know that women are more likely to divorce men earning less than them or stay-at-home dads and the earning power of men and women in marriages changes as compared to unmarried men and women. Etc, etc. Social science gets very messy very quickly.

watwut 9y ago

Alimony applies only if she was stay at home. If both of you work full time, divorce law won't require you to pay alimony.

kelnos 9y ago
Depends on where you are. That's not true in California; there's a lot of flexibility in deciding that here. For example, if the separation will mean that one of the two parties will have to reduce their standard of living below that of what was enjoyed during the marriage, that can result in alimony payments. See http://www.cadivorce.com/california-divorce-guide/spousal-support/how-spousal-support-is-decided-in-california/ http://www.cadivorce.com/california-divorce-guide/spousal-su... for more fun on this topic.

ash 9y ago

Be careful with generalisations. The laws could differ a lot in different countries and even in different states in the US. See the "Real World Divorce" book for details: http://www.realworlddivorce.com http://www.realworlddivorce.com As far as I remember from reading the book, the law favors the spouse with the lower income among the two; and the spouse with child custody.