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why should I consider python at all for a new, multi year project when there is no clear path forward for the language and there hasn't been in a decade? It wo

why should I consider python at all for a new, multi year project when there is no clear path forward for the language and there hasn't been in a decade? It would seem that the article is out of date and there is now a clear path forward. However, I think that we also see here a problem with the BDFL model of programming language governance. Unless Python 3 is somehow well over 2X times more productive than Python 2, I don't see the amount of disruption caused by the change as having been worth it. Is that the case?

matt_wulfeck 10y ago
I agree. I'm sure it's much easier for Python 3 core language development to happen versus 2, but for a regular joe what carrots are there, or is it really all sticks?
- xapata 10y ago
  Check out the "what's new" documents for the various Py3k versions. v3.6 had very nice additions.
  - matt_wulfeck 10y ago
    There's no reason those enhancements couldn't be part of 2 other than the maintainers decided to abandon the language for their own maintabity. That's their peragotive, but doesn't provide material benefits to the actual users.
    - xapata 10y ago
      The maintainers implemented enhancements in both 3.x and 2.x for many years. Eventually they got tired of it. Version 2.7 corresponds to 3.4. The reason why 3.5 is the first 3.x that started to gain a following was that Guido announced there'd be no 2.8. You could argue that the reason folks didn't adopt 3.x quickly was that the core devs stayed committed to 2.x. It's standard practice for software maintenance to work on both the old version and the new fork for a while, giving users a chance to switch. Look at how Microsoft manages versions of Windows. I think the Python devs stand out in their willingness to work on both versions for so long.
- vacri 10y ago
  For system-related stuff, python 2 is already 'everywhere', as it's used all over the place for that kind of thing. Even some nodejs modules depend on python for their installation. But if you're going to be doing more than making a standalone script, python 3 should be your target: that's where the maintenance is going to live, and that is where any 'cool_new_module' gets targeted. If you're going to make something big, do it in an area that gets support. I'm not a particularly advanced user of python (seriously, just ops scripts), but it looks like it's basically 'all sticks' to me. I've heard people grateful about better unicode handling, but not much more than that.

matt_wulfeck 10y ago

I agree. I'm sure it's much easier for Python 3 core language development to happen versus 2, but for a regular joe what carrots are there, or is it really all sticks?

xapata 10y ago
Check out the "what's new" documents for the various Py3k versions. v3.6 had very nice additions.
- matt_wulfeck 10y ago
  There's no reason those enhancements couldn't be part of 2 other than the maintainers decided to abandon the language for their own maintabity. That's their peragotive, but doesn't provide material benefits to the actual users.
  - xapata 10y ago
    The maintainers implemented enhancements in both 3.x and 2.x for many years. Eventually they got tired of it. Version 2.7 corresponds to 3.4. The reason why 3.5 is the first 3.x that started to gain a following was that Guido announced there'd be no 2.8. You could argue that the reason folks didn't adopt 3.x quickly was that the core devs stayed committed to 2.x. It's standard practice for software maintenance to work on both the old version and the new fork for a while, giving users a chance to switch. Look at how Microsoft manages versions of Windows. I think the Python devs stand out in their willingness to work on both versions for so long.
vacri 10y ago
For system-related stuff, python 2 is already 'everywhere', as it's used all over the place for that kind of thing. Even some nodejs modules depend on python for their installation. But if you're going to be doing more than making a standalone script, python 3 should be your target: that's where the maintenance is going to live, and that is where any 'cool_new_module' gets targeted. If you're going to make something big, do it in an area that gets support. I'm not a particularly advanced user of python (seriously, just ops scripts), but it looks like it's basically 'all sticks' to me. I've heard people grateful about better unicode handling, but not much more than that.