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An interesting comment on studying pirates, from /r/AskHistorians: "Pirate questions are often difficult, because pirates as a group have been so heavily ficti
by apsec112 10y ago
An interesting comment on studying pirates, from /r/AskHistorians:
"Pirate questions are often difficult, because pirates as a group have been so heavily fictionalized -- and were often fictionalized even in the "golden age" of piracy (or shortly thereafter) -- that it becomes hard to separate reality from fiction. Indeed, there is evidence that later sailing crews, including pirates, took on behaviors that they may have read or heard that "pirates" did -- even if these accounts were fictional, meaning that fictional accounts of pirate activities actually became reality due to people acting out what they'd seen in fiction." https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/60deda/how_historically_accurate_is_walk_the_plank_how/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/60deda/how_h...
- Sniffnoy 10y agoA note, you seem to have linked to the whole thread, rather than the specific comment you mention: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/60deda/how_historically_accurate_is_walk_the_plank_how/df5wxtp/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/60deda/how_h...
- bitwize 10y agoWell, that's something they have in common with ninjas then. :) Ninjas had lots of rumored abilities and practices ascribed to them which they didn't really have, and the ninjas of the day did nothing to counter the rumors. In fact they helped spread the rumors since it enhanced their fearsome reputation to do so.
- dhimes 10y agoAlso: Samurai. They're know for their Bushido code of honor but there seems to be evidence that the code came about much later, perhaps as a result of the elite trying to get some control over them.
- d0mine 10y agoPirates are not unique in that respect. All mass media is heavily fictionalized. Thomas Jefferson to John Norvell(1807): I will add, that the man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them; inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. He who reads nothing will still learn the great facts, and the details are all false. https://www.loc.gov/resource/mtj1.038_0592_0594/?sp=2&st=text https://www.loc.gov/resource/mtj1.038_0592_0594/?sp=2&st=tex...
- unavoidable 10y agoOT, but, Jefferson appears to have anticipated fake news and the thirst for eyeballs. >To your request of my opinion of the manner in which a newspaper should be conducted, so as to be most useful, I should answer, “by restraining it to true facts & sound principles only.” Yet I fear such a paper would find few subscribers. It is a melancholy truth, that a suppression of the press could not more compleatly deprive the nation of it's benefits, than is done by it's abandoned prostitution to falsehood. Nothing can now be believed which is seen in a newspaper. Truth itself becomes suspicious by being put into that polluted vehicle.
- ivarious 10y agoHe was Hamilton's contemporaries, of course he know a thing or two about fake news.
- beaconstudios 10y agoI think it's less that he anticipated fake news, and more that it's always been a problem. Journalism has always been self-serving - after all, it's a business.
- toyg 10y agoBut politics and industry are similarly self-serving, and that's what journalism is supposed to balance. Everyone lies all the time, and that's always been the case - after all, they are human.
- graphitezepp 10y agoCertainly, I think it is borderline madness that entities such as facebook are being called out in the current "fake news" discussion, this is far from anything new and does not come from media centralization or the internet.
- ep103 10y agoIts a level of degrees, though
- bimjam27 10y agoInteresting because alot of modern day pirates/hackers are exactly the same. Co-opting their identities from movies like "Hackers" and "Sneakers". If you read any of the interview sections of Phrack articles these movies and their aesthetics are all referenced heavily. I think it was ironic/toungue in cheek at first but then turned into something sincere as new generations looked up to the old without context.
- harryf 10y agoGreat point. V for Vendetta / Anonymous would be the most visible example
- efdee 10y agoIndeed. I'm quite sure many of today's Anons wouldn't even know that the mask is a symbol of failure in their own lore.
- blincoln 10y agoCan you elaborate on this? I'm not a member of Anonymous, but I've read the graphic novel version of _V For Vendetta_ as well as seen the film, and I didn't get that impression at all.
- InitialLastName 10y agoThe mask didn't originate with V for Vendetta. It comes from a likeness of Guy Fawkes, whose 5th of November (Gunpowder) plot to blow up the British parliament and impose a Catholic theocracy was thwarted. To celebrate that failure, Brits light fireworks and burn dummies wearing that mask every 11/5.
- Nadya 10y agoYes, but the `Anonymous`/4chan usage is inspired from V for Vendetta, at least to my knowledge of chan history. It just so happens to be the Guy Fawkes mask which holds another meaning for Brits. It might change how some people, especially British people, see the mask but that isn't the intention. For example, a pink triangle means something different now than it did during the 40s and pointing to its historic usage instead of its reclaimed/new usage would be disingenuous and missing the point of how it is being used in the modern context. Pointing to Guy Fawkes instead of Vendetta for Anonymous' usage of the mask is missing the point.