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How is "software used to evade authorities" different from .. using a "radar used to detect highway patrol"?

gvb 9y ago
It isn't. Illegal is illegal no matter the scale[1]. The scale, however, is substantially different between you with a radar detector and Uber's behavior. If you use a radar detector illegally and are caught, you will be fined maybe $150 as a civil infraction (no criminal penalties). If Uber gets convicted of obstruction of justice and violation of RICO statutes, that is now serious federal offenses with very serious criminal penalties (felonies). [1] The irony of your analogy is that Uber's business model is to legally enable "independent contractors" (drivers) to operate an illegal taxi service. Uber is legally brokering an illegal taxi service (the brokering is not breaking taxi service laws). In your analogy, Uber is the radar detector manufacturer and the drivers are the drivers. The drivers are operating illegally in both cases. If Uber stuck to "manufacturing radar detectors" (brokering rides), they would be legal. Instead, in addition to making "radar detectors", they set up "radar jammers" and directly operated the jammers in highly patrolled areas. That is directly illegal and thus Uber is at direct risk of criminal prosecution.
- raspasov 9y ago
  Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I am not an expert in all the law complexities in this area but I feel like that can be a great challenge for a lawyer that's up to the task to try and defend Uber. One can argue (and in my opinion, quite rightfully so) that it's not Uber's responsibility to offer anyone "correct data", especially when someone is trying to use it maliciously against them or their clients. To give another shot at an analogy, the radar manufacturing company doesn't owe the police a working radar (which also happens to be "free" in Uber's case).
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JangoSteve 9y ago
Because a radar detector doesn't send out a signal to the officer's radar fooling giving it a false speed. That essentially is what their software did. It didn't just alert the driver that the person requesting a ride may be law enforcement, it seems it actually showed the officer incorrect data to mislead them about the vehicles' whereabouts. And for the record, radar detectors actually are illegal in many states.

gvb 9y ago

It isn't. Illegal is illegal no matter the scale[1]. The scale, however, is substantially different between you with a radar detector and Uber's behavior. If you use a radar detector illegally and are caught, you will be fined maybe $150 as a civil infraction (no criminal penalties). If Uber gets convicted of obstruction of justice and violation of RICO statutes, that is now serious federal offenses with very serious criminal penalties (felonies). [1] The irony of your analogy is that Uber's business model is to legally enable "independent contractors" (drivers) to operate an illegal taxi service. Uber is legally brokering an illegal taxi service (the brokering is not breaking taxi service laws). In your analogy, Uber is the radar detector manufacturer and the drivers are the drivers. The drivers are operating illegally in both cases. If Uber stuck to "manufacturing radar detectors" (brokering rides), they would be legal. Instead, in addition to making "radar detectors", they set up "radar jammers" and directly operated the jammers in highly patrolled areas. That is directly illegal and thus Uber is at direct risk of criminal prosecution.

raspasov 9y ago
Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I am not an expert in all the law complexities in this area but I feel like that can be a great challenge for a lawyer that's up to the task to try and defend Uber. One can argue (and in my opinion, quite rightfully so) that it's not Uber's responsibility to offer anyone "correct data", especially when someone is trying to use it maliciously against them or their clients. To give another shot at an analogy, the radar manufacturing company doesn't owe the police a working radar (which also happens to be "free" in Uber's case).

deleted 9y ago

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JangoSteve 9y ago

Because a radar detector doesn't send out a signal to the officer's radar fooling giving it a false speed. That essentially is what their software did. It didn't just alert the driver that the person requesting a ride may be law enforcement, it seems it actually showed the officer incorrect data to mislead them about the vehicles' whereabouts. And for the record, radar detectors actually are illegal in many states.