3 ms·

True. But considering RICO's original intent, investigating a software company for evading draconian local taxi regulations seems out of scope.

dpark 9y ago
RICO covers fraud and obstruction of justice, both of which could theoretically apply to Grayball (or not, depending on the facts uncovered).
- bogositosius 9y ago
  >obstruction of justice Fair point. Personally I still think this is overreach but I can follow the legal footing on that.
  - npizzolato 9y ago
    How is it an overreach to define finding who is a LEO and feeding them false information to deceive them and waste their time as obstruction of justice?
    - bogositosius 9y ago
      Because protectionist taxi regulations enacted and enforced by local officials are a local issue. Just because the DOJ can shoehorn a legal argument together to assert jurisdiction doesn't mean it isn't yet another overreach by the already bloated bureaucracy known as the United States government.
      - npizzolato 9y ago
        It's not a local issue when a multinational organization is doing the same thing across an entire country. Then it's rightly a federal issue.
        dpark 9y ago
        If you start with the assumption that the US federal government is bloated and overreaching as a principle, then no matter the facts, you'll still arrive at the conclusion that the US federal government is bloated and overreaching. Logic isn't really relevant.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
TheCoelacanth 9y ago
The whole point of RICO is to allow the feds to intervene when the criminal organization is too large and powerful for local governments to be able to effectively prosecute them. This is exactly what RICO was designed for.
- bogositosius 9y ago
  Which local governments have tried mounting a substantive case and failed?
  - memmcgee 9y ago
    I don't know... Maybe the local governments that were blocked from investigating by Greyball?
    - bogositosius 9y ago
      Then let them build a case against Uber for its use of Greyball. Why is federal involvement under RICO statutes necessary to do that?
malto 9y ago
It's not out of scope. Uber is a corrupt organization. Here's to hoping that one of Travis Kalanick's numerous criminal actions (such as his decision to steal Google's self-driving tech) comes home to roost. There's now a material chance that Ubers investors (and many employees) will get zeroed out due to their reckless, willful, criminal actions. And frankly, that's fucking hilarious.
- bogositosius 9y ago
  >such as his decision to steal Google's self-driving tech When was this proven? So far, those are nothing but allegations in a civil suit.
  - memmcgee 9y ago
    Do you work for Uber or something? Because you seem awfully determined to be willfully dense about this issue.
    - bogositosius 9y ago
      Do you work for a taxi association? See how that pointless allegation swings both ways? If you knew anything about civil litigation, you'd know that what is alleged in lawsuit filings is utterly pointless drivel as far as trying to use it to substantiate a point in a debate. Lawsuit allegations don't have to be factually true, which is why I asked where the allegation has actually been proven.

dpark 9y ago

RICO covers fraud and obstruction of justice, both of which could theoretically apply to Grayball (or not, depending on the facts uncovered).

bogositosius 9y ago
>obstruction of justice Fair point. Personally I still think this is overreach but I can follow the legal footing on that.
- npizzolato 9y ago
  How is it an overreach to define finding who is a LEO and feeding them false information to deceive them and waste their time as obstruction of justice?
  - bogositosius 9y ago
    Because protectionist taxi regulations enacted and enforced by local officials are a local issue. Just because the DOJ can shoehorn a legal argument together to assert jurisdiction doesn't mean it isn't yet another overreach by the already bloated bureaucracy known as the United States government.
    - npizzolato 9y ago
      It's not a local issue when a multinational organization is doing the same thing across an entire country. Then it's rightly a federal issue.
      - dpark 9y ago
        If you start with the assumption that the US federal government is bloated and overreaching as a principle, then no matter the facts, you'll still arrive at the conclusion that the US federal government is bloated and overreaching. Logic isn't really relevant.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

TheCoelacanth 9y ago

The whole point of RICO is to allow the feds to intervene when the criminal organization is too large and powerful for local governments to be able to effectively prosecute them. This is exactly what RICO was designed for.

bogositosius 9y ago
Which local governments have tried mounting a substantive case and failed?
- memmcgee 9y ago
  I don't know... Maybe the local governments that were blocked from investigating by Greyball?
  - bogositosius 9y ago
    Then let them build a case against Uber for its use of Greyball. Why is federal involvement under RICO statutes necessary to do that?

malto 9y ago

It's not out of scope. Uber is a corrupt organization. Here's to hoping that one of Travis Kalanick's numerous criminal actions (such as his decision to steal Google's self-driving tech) comes home to roost. There's now a material chance that Ubers investors (and many employees) will get zeroed out due to their reckless, willful, criminal actions. And frankly, that's fucking hilarious.

bogositosius 9y ago
>such as his decision to steal Google's self-driving tech When was this proven? So far, those are nothing but allegations in a civil suit.
- memmcgee 9y ago
  Do you work for Uber or something? Because you seem awfully determined to be willfully dense about this issue.
  - bogositosius 9y ago
    Do you work for a taxi association? See how that pointless allegation swings both ways? If you knew anything about civil litigation, you'd know that what is alleged in lawsuit filings is utterly pointless drivel as far as trying to use it to substantiate a point in a debate. Lawsuit allegations don't have to be factually true, which is why I asked where the allegation has actually been proven.