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First they should ask if you want to get into VR. I mean, there is a certain crisis, as the hype did not live up and obvious problems (sickness) remained obviou

First they should ask if you want to get into VR. I mean, there is a certain crisis, as the hype did not live up and obvious problems (sickness) remained obvious.

haydenlee 9y ago
As a professional VR developer I'm unaware of this crisis. There's also about as many headsets sold as people thought there would be (and way more GearVR's than expected). I haven't gotten sick from a VR experience (that I wasn't half-way through building) in over a year. The headsets are good enough that they don't make you sick by default (like they used to) and to make somebody sick you have to go against best design practises.
- smacktoward 9y ago
  I'm not a VR developer, but from an outside perspective it actually looks like there are a few different crises. 1) Developers seem to be interested in heavyweight VR systems like Vive and Rift, while users (based on sales figures, anyway) seem to be interested in inexpensive, cordless systems like GearVR and Cardboard. Which leads to the awkward situation where all the innovative software is coming out for hardware that very few users actually own. (And then that market gets segmented even further -- with Rift development now orienting around Rift + Touch, for instance, which leaves users without Touch behind.) 2) "It hasn't made me sick in over a year!" is not an answer to concerns about VR making people sick that is going to get people to rush out and buy hardware. Once a product has developed a rep for making people sick (not everybody, of course, but all it takes is enough people), it can take a long, long time to shake that rep off. 3) There's a fundamental problem that nobody in this generation of VR has been able to really solve yet, which is making a headset that is comfortable to wear for long periods. Even simpler solutions like GearVR are heavy enough that you feel their weight after wearing them for 30 minutes or more, and with developers pushing the platform towards bigger/deeper experiences, the trend in hardware doesn't seem like it'll be running primarily towards weight reduction. This could lead to a self-reinforcing cycle of pushing the tech further and further away from a mass audience, as VR enthusiasts (i.e. people who don't mind the weight of existing hardware) demand higher-resolution experiences, which leads to hardware companies pursuing more power instead of less weight, which leads to products that only sell to VR enthusiasts, who demand higher-resolution experiences, etc. Something similar to this happened to the market for flight simulations in the '90s, which resulted in one of the main categories of entertainment software evolving into a tiny niche market of interest only to obsessives. None of which is to say that VR is doomed, or that these things are in reality as serious as they appear to be to an outsider. But I would say there are plenty of reasons to be skeptical that VR will become a big, mass-market hit, at least this go-around.
  - haydenlee 9y ago
    Appreciate the comment. Here's my thoughts: 1. I think if you looked at the time and money spent in mobile headsets vs heavyweight systems it would tell a different story than sales figures. Better to make a few people love you then lots of people just sorta like you, and all that YC jazz. 2. I'm extremely susceptible to motion sickness and I've been trying most of the latest content so I think I'm a good canary to see if VR actually makes you sick anymore. I do think there are some perception problems that are lingering around longer than I thought they would, and this is a consumer awareness problem that as you say, will take some time to solve. Luckily I think its largely a moot point because everybody that tries good content realizes that it doesn't always make you sick and that they need to have one as soon as they can afford it. 3. I bet every future Oculus Rift and Vive generation will be lighter than they are today. Making a bet that a piece of consumer technology will get heavier and larger as time increases is generally an ill-advised move.
  - omg_ketchup 9y ago
    What's possible on a high-end rig today will be possible on on a phone within 2 years.
    - j2bax 9y ago
      Color me skeptical! 5 years, maybe... 10 years, definitely!
    - mncharity 9y ago
      I was at a Boston VR[0] meetup last week, that was lifestreamed via youtube[1] to AltspaceVR[2]. An organizer used a recent Samsung phone in a Daydream headset (which has a closed back), to host the VR space. The biggest problem seemed the low duty cycle - use it for a few minutes, then take the phone out to cool down. Some demo setups at the recent VRLA Expo, had a small fan attached to the phone. So will we see a GTX 1060 equivalent on a flagship phone in 2 years... maybe? But I was struck by how far we've come already. [0] https://www.meetup.com/Boston-Virtual-Reality/ https://www.meetup.com/Boston-Virtual-Reality/ [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iGszROz58U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iGszROz58U [2] https://altvr.com/ https://altvr.com/
burkaman 9y ago
The majority of this post is about why you might want to get into it.

First they should ask if you want to get into VR. I mean, there is a certain crisis, as the hype did not live up and obvious problems (sickness) remained obvious.

haydenlee 9y ago

As a professional VR developer I'm unaware of this crisis. There's also about as many headsets sold as people thought there would be (and way more GearVR's than expected). I haven't gotten sick from a VR experience (that I wasn't half-way through building) in over a year. The headsets are good enough that they don't make you sick by default (like they used to) and to make somebody sick you have to go against best design practises.

smacktoward 9y ago
I'm not a VR developer, but from an outside perspective it actually looks like there are a few different crises. 1) Developers seem to be interested in heavyweight VR systems like Vive and Rift, while users (based on sales figures, anyway) seem to be interested in inexpensive, cordless systems like GearVR and Cardboard. Which leads to the awkward situation where all the innovative software is coming out for hardware that very few users actually own. (And then that market gets segmented even further -- with Rift development now orienting around Rift + Touch, for instance, which leaves users without Touch behind.) 2) "It hasn't made me sick in over a year!" is not an answer to concerns about VR making people sick that is going to get people to rush out and buy hardware. Once a product has developed a rep for making people sick (not everybody, of course, but all it takes is enough people), it can take a long, long time to shake that rep off. 3) There's a fundamental problem that nobody in this generation of VR has been able to really solve yet, which is making a headset that is comfortable to wear for long periods. Even simpler solutions like GearVR are heavy enough that you feel their weight after wearing them for 30 minutes or more, and with developers pushing the platform towards bigger/deeper experiences, the trend in hardware doesn't seem like it'll be running primarily towards weight reduction. This could lead to a self-reinforcing cycle of pushing the tech further and further away from a mass audience, as VR enthusiasts (i.e. people who don't mind the weight of existing hardware) demand higher-resolution experiences, which leads to hardware companies pursuing more power instead of less weight, which leads to products that only sell to VR enthusiasts, who demand higher-resolution experiences, etc. Something similar to this happened to the market for flight simulations in the '90s, which resulted in one of the main categories of entertainment software evolving into a tiny niche market of interest only to obsessives. None of which is to say that VR is doomed, or that these things are in reality as serious as they appear to be to an outsider. But I would say there are plenty of reasons to be skeptical that VR will become a big, mass-market hit, at least this go-around.
- haydenlee 9y ago
  Appreciate the comment. Here's my thoughts: 1. I think if you looked at the time and money spent in mobile headsets vs heavyweight systems it would tell a different story than sales figures. Better to make a few people love you then lots of people just sorta like you, and all that YC jazz. 2. I'm extremely susceptible to motion sickness and I've been trying most of the latest content so I think I'm a good canary to see if VR actually makes you sick anymore. I do think there are some perception problems that are lingering around longer than I thought they would, and this is a consumer awareness problem that as you say, will take some time to solve. Luckily I think its largely a moot point because everybody that tries good content realizes that it doesn't always make you sick and that they need to have one as soon as they can afford it. 3. I bet every future Oculus Rift and Vive generation will be lighter than they are today. Making a bet that a piece of consumer technology will get heavier and larger as time increases is generally an ill-advised move.
- omg_ketchup 9y ago
  What's possible on a high-end rig today will be possible on on a phone within 2 years.
  - j2bax 9y ago
    Color me skeptical! 5 years, maybe... 10 years, definitely!
  - mncharity 9y ago
    I was at a Boston VR[0] meetup last week, that was lifestreamed via youtube[1] to AltspaceVR[2]. An organizer used a recent Samsung phone in a Daydream headset (which has a closed back), to host the VR space. The biggest problem seemed the low duty cycle - use it for a few minutes, then take the phone out to cool down. Some demo setups at the recent VRLA Expo, had a small fan attached to the phone. So will we see a GTX 1060 equivalent on a flagship phone in 2 years... maybe? But I was struck by how far we've come already. [0] https://www.meetup.com/Boston-Virtual-Reality/ https://www.meetup.com/Boston-Virtual-Reality/ [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iGszROz58U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iGszROz58U [2] https://altvr.com/ https://altvr.com/

burkaman 9y ago

The majority of this post is about why you might want to get into it.