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What seems to be particularly interesting about this is the response from the incumbent automakers. It seemed like they were dragging their feet (they were), bu

What seems to be particularly interesting about this is the response from the incumbent automakers. It seemed like they were dragging their feet (they were), but more likely they were waiting for the technology to be affordable for the mass market. The much fabled EV1 apparently cost GM around 250K apiece [1]. So while it's easy to criticise them and other big automakers for resisting electrification, the tech really wasn't ready until very recently. They basically sat back and left someone else take the risk before jumping in. And now their electrification goals seem pretty aggressive considering the infrastructure. [1] https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2013/06/27/cars-of-futures-past-gm-ev1/ https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2013/06/27/cars-of-futures-pas...

mixedbit 9y ago
This seems very high, maybe they included research and infrastructure cost in this 250k/unit estimation?
- pjc50 9y ago
  This "NRE" should always be included in the cost of manufactured goods. It's why things like the B2 and F35 are so expensive. GM only made just over 1,000 EV1s, they were practically hand-built. Such a small run gives them the same kind of cost structure as boutique sports cars.
labcomputer 9y ago
Get real. The auto makers aren't passive players who "have things happen to them." No, they are active participants who "make things happen." Of course the technology wasn't ready--they didn't build it! What they should have done is to say, "This is the technology we have to work with today. How can we build a compelling vehicle with it?" That is, in fact, exactly what Tesla did (and continue to iterate). That's why Tesla started with a $200k+ boutique vehicle and have started to work their way down market. And it might have something to do with the relative market cap of Tesla and GM.
cmrdporcupine 9y ago
GM did not sit back and let someone else take the risk. They pioneered in this space. The Volt, Spark EV, and now the Bolt are all extremely well engineered cars that are ahead of everyone else in the industry except Tesla. And in one way, ahead of Tesla in bringing such products to a regular mass market consumer. And it is one thing to burn through VC building unprofitable products like Tesla did -- GM brought EVs to market as an established long term corporation that had to drive revenue and profits. EDIT: in some ways it is precisely _Tesla_ that has let someone else (their investors) take the risk. Everyone else dabbled in EV. GM actually made seriously good products. Their dealers are shitty at selling them, and the volume of production is low -- but that is for concrete reasons: battery supply, cost of production, lack of demand. I have a Volt on order. It is a seriously amazing machine. Very few compromises, very much like a best-of-both-worlds scenario. Tesla-fans and EV purists diss it, but it is in many ways the perfection of the hybrid concept and leaning towards EV. I'd love to go pure EV but there isn't a product out there for me yet. Luckily GM of all companies has something to sell me.

mixedbit 9y ago

This seems very high, maybe they included research and infrastructure cost in this 250k/unit estimation?

pjc50 9y ago
This "NRE" should always be included in the cost of manufactured goods. It's why things like the B2 and F35 are so expensive. GM only made just over 1,000 EV1s, they were practically hand-built. Such a small run gives them the same kind of cost structure as boutique sports cars.

labcomputer 9y ago

Get real. The auto makers aren't passive players who "have things happen to them." No, they are active participants who "make things happen." Of course the technology wasn't ready--they didn't build it! What they should have done is to say, "This is the technology we have to work with today. How can we build a compelling vehicle with it?" That is, in fact, exactly what Tesla did (and continue to iterate). That's why Tesla started with a $200k+ boutique vehicle and have started to work their way down market. And it might have something to do with the relative market cap of Tesla and GM.

cmrdporcupine 9y ago

GM did not sit back and let someone else take the risk. They pioneered in this space. The Volt, Spark EV, and now the Bolt are all extremely well engineered cars that are ahead of everyone else in the industry except Tesla. And in one way, ahead of Tesla in bringing such products to a regular mass market consumer. And it is one thing to burn through VC building unprofitable products like Tesla did -- GM brought EVs to market as an established long term corporation that had to drive revenue and profits. EDIT: in some ways it is precisely _Tesla_ that has let someone else (their investors) take the risk. Everyone else dabbled in EV. GM actually made seriously good products. Their dealers are shitty at selling them, and the volume of production is low -- but that is for concrete reasons: battery supply, cost of production, lack of demand. I have a Volt on order. It is a seriously amazing machine. Very few compromises, very much like a best-of-both-worlds scenario. Tesla-fans and EV purists diss it, but it is in many ways the perfection of the hybrid concept and leaning towards EV. I'd love to go pure EV but there isn't a product out there for me yet. Luckily GM of all companies has something to sell me.