4 ms·

As I understand it, the direct cause of the crisis wasn't that they changed water. It was they changed water and were totally incompetent in doing it. The basic

As I understand it, the direct cause of the crisis wasn't that they changed water. It was they changed water and were totally incompetent in doing it. The basic PH levels in the new water are easily compensated for. Flint just didn't. It's like if an uber driver canceled your pick up and the next one you got was drunk driving. Sure that first driver was a but-for cause, but not a direct cause. They have no moral culpability for the reckless actions of the next person. edit: edited to correct the ph level as suggest by max.

maxerickson 10y ago
The river water has too low of a ph, the correction is to increase it.
- ceejayoz 10y ago
  Yep. And it wouldn't have cost much. Emphasis mine: > Marc Edwards, a professor at Virginia Tech who has been testing Flint water, says treatment could have corrected much of the problem early on — for as little as $100 a day — but officials in the city of 100,000 people didn't take action. > "There is no question that if the city had followed the minimum requirements under federal law that none of this would have happened," said Edwards, who obtained the Muchmore email through a Michigan Freedom of Information Act request. http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/internal-email-michigan-blowing-flint-over-lead-water-n491481 http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/internal-email-mic...
  - irixusr 10y ago
    Interesting. Although I tend to attribute things like this to ignorance and not malice. < Helps me pretend people aren't so bad. The people who make decisions often don't know what they're deciding about (how can the same person make a good decision about child education, policing standards and public hygiene?) and I think our modern philosophy that a "bad decision made early is better than no decision" amplifies this. There are some decisions in life that have to made carefully so we don't ask for forgiveness.
    - maxerickson 10y ago
      The importance of pipe scale and water chemistry is something that the person making the decision absolutely should have known. It's a huge systemic issue if the decision has been taken away from someone with that basic technical knowledge and handed to some administrator. It really is pretty basic knowledge for someone making decisions about a water system.
      - spacemanmatt 10y ago
        ...which is why the trend of conservative-run states usurping power from cities is so disturbing to me
rmason 10y ago
The governor appointed an emergency manager to manage Flint's affairs. He decided to move to Flint river water to save money. But the Flint water department was woefully inadequate to handle the change and state interpreted EPA rules to allow them to not add chemicals to the water. Coincidentally the state is currently building a water pipeline from Lake Huron for Flint that the new mayor announced that she will not use. The mayor wants to stay on Detroit water and the state may sue Flint to get them to change. Note I am in East Lansing an hour west of Flint.

maxerickson 10y ago

The river water has too low of a ph, the correction is to increase it.

ceejayoz 10y ago
Yep. And it wouldn't have cost much. Emphasis mine: > Marc Edwards, a professor at Virginia Tech who has been testing Flint water, says treatment could have corrected much of the problem early on — for as little as $100 a day — but officials in the city of 100,000 people didn't take action. > "There is no question that if the city had followed the minimum requirements under federal law that none of this would have happened," said Edwards, who obtained the Muchmore email through a Michigan Freedom of Information Act request. http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/internal-email-michigan-blowing-flint-over-lead-water-n491481 http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/internal-email-mic...
- irixusr 10y ago
  Interesting. Although I tend to attribute things like this to ignorance and not malice. < Helps me pretend people aren't so bad. The people who make decisions often don't know what they're deciding about (how can the same person make a good decision about child education, policing standards and public hygiene?) and I think our modern philosophy that a "bad decision made early is better than no decision" amplifies this. There are some decisions in life that have to made carefully so we don't ask for forgiveness.
  - maxerickson 10y ago
    The importance of pipe scale and water chemistry is something that the person making the decision absolutely should have known. It's a huge systemic issue if the decision has been taken away from someone with that basic technical knowledge and handed to some administrator. It really is pretty basic knowledge for someone making decisions about a water system.
    - spacemanmatt 10y ago
      ...which is why the trend of conservative-run states usurping power from cities is so disturbing to me

rmason 10y ago

The governor appointed an emergency manager to manage Flint's affairs. He decided to move to Flint river water to save money. But the Flint water department was woefully inadequate to handle the change and state interpreted EPA rules to allow them to not add chemicals to the water. Coincidentally the state is currently building a water pipeline from Lake Huron for Flint that the new mayor announced that she will not use. The mayor wants to stay on Detroit water and the state may sue Flint to get them to change. Note I am in East Lansing an hour west of Flint.