4 ms·

I think that's a fair choice for a number of reasons. The problem is, the need for an external workspace still isn't going away. This is a /huge/ market opportu

I think that's a fair choice for a number of reasons. The problem is, the need for an external workspace still isn't going away. This is a /huge/ market opportunity, and anybody who has gone to Workshop Cafe in San Francisco knows it. (Just try to find a seat there during business hours; it's impossible.) The problem with the coffee shop is that the value they provide and their financial model are not aligned. Coffee shops make money by selling coffee. Workers go to coffee shops for the workspace, location, and ambiance of not working from home. Yes, people also go to coffee shops to buy coffee, but I'm not talking about those people. There is a class of person (freelancers, artists, even people just taking the day off from their normal office) who want a non-lonely place to work around people. The only business I've seen who "gets it" is Workshop Cafe -- a coffee shop that makes its money by selling the workspace, not the coffee (but yes they do also serve coffee). They have power outlets at every seat, incredible Wi-Fi, and charge $2 / hour (at least last time I was there) for a seat, and even have phone booths for calls. There should be a Workshop Cafe in every major city on Earth. There's already a WeWork for the more permanent class of co-working; why is there not a "coffee shop" that focuses its business catering toward laptop hobos, and actually provides amenities for that use -- no more scrounging for power outlets, crappy Wi-Fi, nowhere to take a call, et cetera. Workshop Cafe in SF will even deliver food from local restaurants to your table! Then, finally, we will have two types of businesses for these two completely separate use cases: coffee shop-style drop-in co-working spaces, for people who want to get work done in a productive environment, and coffee shops. For you know, people who just want to drink a cup of coffee.

pkaye 9y ago
I think initially when a coffee shop starts out they want those who stick around for a long time in order to show they are a busy place and attract more customers. But once they grow to be busy enough they longer care about those customers who stick around for a long time. Also how would the economics of a Workshop Cafe work? How much would the hourly cost be to get a table?
- agibsonccc 9y ago
  They've been growing with their current model ($2/hr/seat). I was in SF recently (used to live there, don't anymore..) but whenever I am in town I go there even when having a nice office to go to. Granted - I don't know all of their economics but they definitely charge a bit for food but I find the atmosphere great enough to pay for that.
  - marak830 9y ago
    I wonder how well that would work here in Japan. You don't see as many people working on laptops in a coffee shop here, but you do see an awful lot of English teaching and students studying
    - agibsonccc 9y ago
      Being based in tokyo...I see that a lot at various starbucks. I don't know where you frequent but I see a ton of people working on laptops in cafes. Granted, there are folks who do the "talk to your friend" thing but I don't see much of a difference between SF and Tokyo in that respect. I usually see this in the more typical local chains like Doutour, Pronto, and even excelsior (despite them usually lacking outlets) as well.
      - marak830 9y ago
        I'm in Totsuka near Yokohama, it's not a very tech area.
        agibsonccc 9y ago
        Yeah that makes sense then.
lactau 9y ago
So strange to read about it as if it is something new. We had these things since 2010 and they are very popular in Russia. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-café https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-café
smsm42 9y ago
That sounds awesome, and too bad there's not more of these around. Though I can see how it requires certain density of potential clients to work, may not be that workable outside of dense cities (so OK in San Francisco, iffy in San Jose). But I'd use such service, provided I can get comfortable seating, good Wifi and some tea, etc. and booths for calls. If one was near me, I'd seriously think about a monthly subscription (provided it's suitably discounted from the hourly rate). OTOH, when I am using coffee shop for its intended purpose, I also like to browse the internet. So of two coffeeshops one of which offers wifi and another doesn't, I'd probably go to the former even if I don't plan to work there.

pkaye 9y ago

I think initially when a coffee shop starts out they want those who stick around for a long time in order to show they are a busy place and attract more customers. But once they grow to be busy enough they longer care about those customers who stick around for a long time. Also how would the economics of a Workshop Cafe work? How much would the hourly cost be to get a table?

agibsonccc 9y ago
They've been growing with their current model ($2/hr/seat). I was in SF recently (used to live there, don't anymore..) but whenever I am in town I go there even when having a nice office to go to. Granted - I don't know all of their economics but they definitely charge a bit for food but I find the atmosphere great enough to pay for that.
- marak830 9y ago
  I wonder how well that would work here in Japan. You don't see as many people working on laptops in a coffee shop here, but you do see an awful lot of English teaching and students studying
  - agibsonccc 9y ago
    Being based in tokyo...I see that a lot at various starbucks. I don't know where you frequent but I see a ton of people working on laptops in cafes. Granted, there are folks who do the "talk to your friend" thing but I don't see much of a difference between SF and Tokyo in that respect. I usually see this in the more typical local chains like Doutour, Pronto, and even excelsior (despite them usually lacking outlets) as well.
    - marak830 9y ago
      I'm in Totsuka near Yokohama, it's not a very tech area.
      - agibsonccc 9y ago
        Yeah that makes sense then.

lactau 9y ago

So strange to read about it as if it is something new. We had these things since 2010 and they are very popular in Russia. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-café https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-café

smsm42 9y ago

That sounds awesome, and too bad there's not more of these around. Though I can see how it requires certain density of potential clients to work, may not be that workable outside of dense cities (so OK in San Francisco, iffy in San Jose). But I'd use such service, provided I can get comfortable seating, good Wifi and some tea, etc. and booths for calls. If one was near me, I'd seriously think about a monthly subscription (provided it's suitably discounted from the hourly rate). OTOH, when I am using coffee shop for its intended purpose, I also like to browse the internet. So of two coffeeshops one of which offers wifi and another doesn't, I'd probably go to the former even if I don't plan to work there.