45 ms·

In my opinion, unless German IT companies accept to work in English because available workforce in neighbor countries already know English, or they're going to

In my opinion, unless German IT companies accept to work in English because available workforce in neighbor countries already know English, or they're going to have problems attracting world-class talent. I.e. accepting as "acceptable behavior" people not willing to learn German as a requirement.

kayoone 9y ago
I live and work in the Berlin startup world: "English is a must, German is a plus" is the status quo.
orless 9y ago
Many big companies (like SAP) are totally fine with English only. I know a lot of people working in Germany for many years already, almost without speaking a word in German.
wolfgke 9y ago
> German IT companies accept to work in English because available workforce in neighbor countries already know English Let's look at the neighbor countries of Germany and my impressions of their German language skills: Austria: German is spoken there Belgium: ? Czechia: Czechs who want to work in Germany often know German (to me) surprisingly well (this can perhaps be explained by German history (keyword: Sudetenland)) Denmark: ? France: French people IMHO are typically neither good at English nor German Luxembourg: German is one of the languages spoken there the Netherlands: They typically know German quite well (though they often don't like using this language) Poland: Poles who want to work in Germany often know German (to me) surprisingly well (this can perhaps be explained by the German history with the historical expanse of the German Reich) Switzerland: German is one of the languages spoken there (not that the Swiss would prefer to work in Germany over their own country for obvious reasons) TLDR: In many Germany's neighboring countries it is common to know German on a decent level - at least if you plan to work in Germany. If there was I second language from a neighboring country in which work should be accepted, this should rather be French (for France and Belgium) instead of English.
- faragon 9y ago
  > TLDR: In many Germany's neighboring countries it is common to know German on a decent level - at least if you plan to work in Germany. If there was I second language from a neighboring country in which work should be accepted, this should rather be French (for France and Belgium) instead of English. Sure, e.g. I did myself one year of German courses (I forgot most of it, because it was long time ago). In my opinion the point is to make attractive world-class talent for working in Germany, even for short periods of time. I.e. the "nationalist barrier", that is still very strong in Germany and also e.g. in France, in my opinion hurts badly IT companies (fortunately, now is a much smaller problem versus how it was 15-20 years ago, when it was very difficult to work in Germany or France with just English). In my opinion, unless European Union countries become more pragmatic, accepting the English as the "IT language", or the handicap for hiring world-class talent will still be a issue, for both the internal EU job market, and also for getting international talent (e.g. a talented Indian would try first to work in the USA or the UK just because he already did English in the school, being ha handicap having to learn French or German for a temporary job).
  - wolfgke 9y ago
    You explicitly talked of "neighboring countries" of Germany - here I provided evidence that the situation is different. > being ha handicap having to learn French or German for a temporary job Here I rather see the problem: The people only want a temporary job in Germany - so they see Germany just as a stepping stone for their career. If I were a staff manager at a company, I would be very cautious to hire such a person, since in Germany it is seen as a desirable trait that a person does not switch jobs every few years. There are "legal period of notice" which hold for both sides: An employer can after some probation period not simply fire an employee without a period of notice, but the other implication does also hold: After the probation period an employee cannot simply quit the job without a period of notice, too.
    - faragon 9y ago
      Well, for neighboring countries I meant EU countries. You can have near unlimited low-qualification worker supply from your strictly speaking neighboring countries, but not necessarily world-class skilled workers, specially, if those workers willing to move from one country to another can pick options with less conditions. Also, you can have potential supply, not willing to move, just because of nationalist stuff (forced "integration") or other elements that could make a country less attractive than another. Don't get me wrong: I would love Germany, and all EU countries getting as much talent as possible, from the internal EU area, and also from other countries as well. I'm worried about nationalism and the lack of pragmatism ruining job flexibility and business attractiveness, so European companies have such a huge handicap for competing in the international market.

kayoone 9y ago

I live and work in the Berlin startup world: "English is a must, German is a plus" is the status quo.

orless 9y ago

Many big companies (like SAP) are totally fine with English only. I know a lot of people working in Germany for many years already, almost without speaking a word in German.

wolfgke 9y ago

> German IT companies accept to work in English because available workforce in neighbor countries already know English Let's look at the neighbor countries of Germany and my impressions of their German language skills: Austria: German is spoken there Belgium: ? Czechia: Czechs who want to work in Germany often know German (to me) surprisingly well (this can perhaps be explained by German history (keyword: Sudetenland)) Denmark: ? France: French people IMHO are typically neither good at English nor German Luxembourg: German is one of the languages spoken there the Netherlands: They typically know German quite well (though they often don't like using this language) Poland: Poles who want to work in Germany often know German (to me) surprisingly well (this can perhaps be explained by the German history with the historical expanse of the German Reich) Switzerland: German is one of the languages spoken there (not that the Swiss would prefer to work in Germany over their own country for obvious reasons) TLDR: In many Germany's neighboring countries it is common to know German on a decent level - at least if you plan to work in Germany. If there was I second language from a neighboring country in which work should be accepted, this should rather be French (for France and Belgium) instead of English.

faragon 9y ago
> TLDR: In many Germany's neighboring countries it is common to know German on a decent level - at least if you plan to work in Germany. If there was I second language from a neighboring country in which work should be accepted, this should rather be French (for France and Belgium) instead of English. Sure, e.g. I did myself one year of German courses (I forgot most of it, because it was long time ago). In my opinion the point is to make attractive world-class talent for working in Germany, even for short periods of time. I.e. the "nationalist barrier", that is still very strong in Germany and also e.g. in France, in my opinion hurts badly IT companies (fortunately, now is a much smaller problem versus how it was 15-20 years ago, when it was very difficult to work in Germany or France with just English). In my opinion, unless European Union countries become more pragmatic, accepting the English as the "IT language", or the handicap for hiring world-class talent will still be a issue, for both the internal EU job market, and also for getting international talent (e.g. a talented Indian would try first to work in the USA or the UK just because he already did English in the school, being ha handicap having to learn French or German for a temporary job).
- wolfgke 9y ago
  You explicitly talked of "neighboring countries" of Germany - here I provided evidence that the situation is different. > being ha handicap having to learn French or German for a temporary job Here I rather see the problem: The people only want a temporary job in Germany - so they see Germany just as a stepping stone for their career. If I were a staff manager at a company, I would be very cautious to hire such a person, since in Germany it is seen as a desirable trait that a person does not switch jobs every few years. There are "legal period of notice" which hold for both sides: An employer can after some probation period not simply fire an employee without a period of notice, but the other implication does also hold: After the probation period an employee cannot simply quit the job without a period of notice, too.
  - faragon 9y ago
    Well, for neighboring countries I meant EU countries. You can have near unlimited low-qualification worker supply from your strictly speaking neighboring countries, but not necessarily world-class skilled workers, specially, if those workers willing to move from one country to another can pick options with less conditions. Also, you can have potential supply, not willing to move, just because of nationalist stuff (forced "integration") or other elements that could make a country less attractive than another. Don't get me wrong: I would love Germany, and all EU countries getting as much talent as possible, from the internal EU area, and also from other countries as well. I'm worried about nationalism and the lack of pragmatism ruining job flexibility and business attractiveness, so European companies have such a huge handicap for competing in the international market.