4 ms·

Agreed the finance "layer" of the world today is important and can have large positive/negative effects on the "real" part of the economy. I just don't think it

Agreed the finance "layer" of the world today is important and can have large positive/negative effects on the "real" part of the economy. I just don't think it's part of the foundation. One thought experiment would be to imagine the world without finance: could we still eat? have places to sleep at night? Raise kids? Heck yes. Now instead imagine a world without food or shelter or babies, or the ability to make them. We'd be doomed. Also, humans lived millions of years without finance and can again in the future if really needed. We can't live without food production/consumption. Foundation elements are revealed real quick in these kinds of comparisons, I think. Again, not to dismiss finance and capital markets, investment, etc. as non-useful. It's just that they are a very modern and recent invention, at best one particular tool, and only an abstract layer on top of the more "real" parts of human existance.

Aetius 16y ago
Modern society, esp. one nearing 7 billion in number cannot live without finance. Without finance to equitably allocate resources, there would be massive shortages -> famines -> wars -> apocalypse. However, I am going to pull the intellectually lazy card and not go through all the trouble to prove this, and allow the reader to chew on it as a hypothesis. It's late, and I'm tired.
starkfist 16y ago
Finance has been around in some form since ancient Babylon.
coryl 16y ago
Well I suppose if you want to look at it like that, than by strict definition, you're right, we can still have a functioning society without capital markets. But as today's cities/nation states, at some comparable level of comfort and consumption, we cannot function without those markets. Hence why there are those of us who believe they are the foundation of modern society.
deleted 16y ago
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fgf 16y ago
They are neither modern nor recent, you are completely wrong about this. And when people abolish capital markets people have a tendency to starve, see the russian revolution, maos great leap forward and the de-colonization of the third world. Today the us is at a level of prosperity that would make sure people didn't starve if financial markets disappeared, it got that rich trough a process of economic growth for wich financial markets were essential.

Aetius 16y ago

Modern society, esp. one nearing 7 billion in number cannot live without finance. Without finance to equitably allocate resources, there would be massive shortages -> famines -> wars -> apocalypse. However, I am going to pull the intellectually lazy card and not go through all the trouble to prove this, and allow the reader to chew on it as a hypothesis. It's late, and I'm tired.

starkfist 16y ago

Finance has been around in some form since ancient Babylon.

coryl 16y ago

Well I suppose if you want to look at it like that, than by strict definition, you're right, we can still have a functioning society without capital markets. But as today's cities/nation states, at some comparable level of comfort and consumption, we cannot function without those markets. Hence why there are those of us who believe they are the foundation of modern society.

deleted 16y ago

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fgf 16y ago

They are neither modern nor recent, you are completely wrong about this. And when people abolish capital markets people have a tendency to starve, see the russian revolution, maos great leap forward and the de-colonization of the third world. Today the us is at a level of prosperity that would make sure people didn't starve if financial markets disappeared, it got that rich trough a process of economic growth for wich financial markets were essential.