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What an epic failure on PayPal's part. Is there some banking law that I'm unaware of that would cause them to take such drastic actions? It sounds like the OP i

What an epic failure on PayPal's part. Is there some banking law that I'm unaware of that would cause them to take such drastic actions? It sounds like the OP is definitely above the age of 18 now too, so why would PayPal suddenly decide to yank the rug out from under him? It'll be interesting to see if there's a follow up.

iDemonix 10y ago
I'm 26 now, almost 27. I think it was the "We'll contact you within 180 days" thing that pissed me off the most, because it's just such a crap, random number that I likely agreed to in their ToS. As a partial update, after spending 30 minutes clicking every page of the dashboard, it was obvious that money was stuck, and my friend couldn't dispute it as it was sent as a gift, as it wasn't payment for work. Luckily, if you head back to your settings and flick back to the old web UI whilst it's still available, the refund button shows up in the view transaction details page, and it let me refund it. I lost the £20 or so in fees, but at least I can pay some unexpected bills more easily now.
- dangrossman 10y ago
  It's not random. It's the standard period for holding funds of a terminated merchant account with virtually any bank or credit card processor in the world. That's because it's the maximum chargeback period for most credit cards. If they release funds before that date, someone who paid you in the past could reverse that payment, and PayPal would have no funds of yours to cover it, leaving them on the hook for your loss.
- goatforce5 10y ago
  > I likely agreed to in their ToS If they're saying you can't agree to the ToS when you're under 18, should they be able to hold on to the monies for 180 days because that's what the ToS said when you agreed to them?
  - dangrossman 10y ago
    Minors can enter contracts, and they are binding upon the minor until and unless the minor voids the contract. As he's no longer a minor, he would not be able to void it now, so he's bound by its terms.
    - __david__ 10y ago
      But if Paypal believed that were true then there's no reason for them to close the account and hold the money in the first place. :-)
jcwayne 10y ago
Not sure about UK laws, but my (limited) understanding of US law is that a minor lacks the legal capacity to sign a contract (i.e. agree to TOS). I suspect that's the legal reasoning that's caused PayPal to adopt this policy. PayPal could and should find a better way to handle transitioning people who, out of necessity, lied about their age when they first signed up. Was signing up under false pretenses a form of fraud? Probably, but it's a form of fraud that's essentially benign and is so pervasive, online and off, that it's just stupid to treat it as such.
- iDemonix 10y ago
  I'm pretty sure PayPal have updated their ToS since and I've had to re-agree upon login? Would that not cover me?
  - imchillyb 10y ago
    Terms of service, and conditions, are part of a contract they are not a contract in and of itself. You signed the contract when you started your account. Which, is why they want you to start a new account so that you will sign a new contract with them.
- jrnichols 10y ago
  True, but in some areas and under many circumstances, 17 can be considered an adult. It's not like the OP was 12 and trying to circumvent COPPA or something like that. It seems like PayPal went bananas applying a peculiar policy. They want to be a bank, but you can be 12 and still have a bank account. Perhaps PayPal should/could just ask the OP to get a signed permission slip from the parents to cover this. :-)
- user5994461 10y ago
  Minor can absolutely sign contracts. However, it's likely that minors are not allowed to have "adult" bank accounts like PayPal. If so, registering is committing fraud and paypal is forced to shut down the account. Typical case of a children going against the law and the laws fights back and the child doesn't like it.
- 10y ago
user5994461 10y ago
> Is there some banking law that I'm unaware of that would cause them to take such drastic actions? I'd say there are at least 3, don't even need to read the article. If we really want to search all regulations. We should be about to find at dozens to justify the action, without too much issue. I have learnt 3 things from my time on the other side: 1) When you dig deeper, for 90% of complaints, the actions were justified. 2) A percentage of these, ranging from little to quite sizeable depending on the issue, is assimilable to complete fraud. 3) There are tons of regulations in finance. From annoying rules per good/country to anti-money laundering, including plain theft and anti-terrorism supporting scheme. 4) Companies do what they do because of regulations, the regulations themselves are there because the world is a mess.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

iDemonix 10y ago

I'm 26 now, almost 27. I think it was the "We'll contact you within 180 days" thing that pissed me off the most, because it's just such a crap, random number that I likely agreed to in their ToS. As a partial update, after spending 30 minutes clicking every page of the dashboard, it was obvious that money was stuck, and my friend couldn't dispute it as it was sent as a gift, as it wasn't payment for work. Luckily, if you head back to your settings and flick back to the old web UI whilst it's still available, the refund button shows up in the view transaction details page, and it let me refund it. I lost the £20 or so in fees, but at least I can pay some unexpected bills more easily now.

dangrossman 10y ago
It's not random. It's the standard period for holding funds of a terminated merchant account with virtually any bank or credit card processor in the world. That's because it's the maximum chargeback period for most credit cards. If they release funds before that date, someone who paid you in the past could reverse that payment, and PayPal would have no funds of yours to cover it, leaving them on the hook for your loss.
goatforce5 10y ago
> I likely agreed to in their ToS If they're saying you can't agree to the ToS when you're under 18, should they be able to hold on to the monies for 180 days because that's what the ToS said when you agreed to them?
- dangrossman 10y ago
  Minors can enter contracts, and they are binding upon the minor until and unless the minor voids the contract. As he's no longer a minor, he would not be able to void it now, so he's bound by its terms.
  - __david__ 10y ago
    But if Paypal believed that were true then there's no reason for them to close the account and hold the money in the first place. :-)

jcwayne 10y ago

Not sure about UK laws, but my (limited) understanding of US law is that a minor lacks the legal capacity to sign a contract (i.e. agree to TOS). I suspect that's the legal reasoning that's caused PayPal to adopt this policy. PayPal could and should find a better way to handle transitioning people who, out of necessity, lied about their age when they first signed up. Was signing up under false pretenses a form of fraud? Probably, but it's a form of fraud that's essentially benign and is so pervasive, online and off, that it's just stupid to treat it as such.

iDemonix 10y ago
I'm pretty sure PayPal have updated their ToS since and I've had to re-agree upon login? Would that not cover me?
- imchillyb 10y ago
  Terms of service, and conditions, are part of a contract they are not a contract in and of itself. You signed the contract when you started your account. Which, is why they want you to start a new account so that you will sign a new contract with them.
jrnichols 10y ago
True, but in some areas and under many circumstances, 17 can be considered an adult. It's not like the OP was 12 and trying to circumvent COPPA or something like that. It seems like PayPal went bananas applying a peculiar policy. They want to be a bank, but you can be 12 and still have a bank account. Perhaps PayPal should/could just ask the OP to get a signed permission slip from the parents to cover this. :-)
user5994461 10y ago
Minor can absolutely sign contracts. However, it's likely that minors are not allowed to have "adult" bank accounts like PayPal. If so, registering is committing fraud and paypal is forced to shut down the account. Typical case of a children going against the law and the laws fights back and the child doesn't like it.
10y ago

user5994461 10y ago

> Is there some banking law that I'm unaware of that would cause them to take such drastic actions? I'd say there are at least 3, don't even need to read the article. If we really want to search all regulations. We should be about to find at dozens to justify the action, without too much issue. I have learnt 3 things from my time on the other side: 1) When you dig deeper, for 90% of complaints, the actions were justified. 2) A percentage of these, ranging from little to quite sizeable depending on the issue, is assimilable to complete fraud. 3) There are tons of regulations in finance. From annoying rules per good/country to anti-money laundering, including plain theft and anti-terrorism supporting scheme. 4) Companies do what they do because of regulations, the regulations themselves are there because the world is a mess.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]