5 ms·

Meanwhile, in the U.S., the administration is taking down government websites in an effort to bury climate data and scientific information. Useful to remember i

Meanwhile, in the U.S., the administration is taking down government websites in an effort to bury climate data and scientific information. Useful to remember it's not just countries like China and Turkey that try to limit citizens' access to information. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2017/04/28/epa-website-removes-climate-science-site-from-public-view-after-two-decades/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/20...

candiodari 10y ago
Important caveat: the US government is reducing it's own efforts to combat climate change. That's not censorship.
- sverhagen 10y ago
  I've read through a few definitions of the word "censorship", just now, and I don't think any of them make this particular distinction.
  - briandear 10y ago
    There is a distinction between open government and censorship. Not releasing information is different than banning people from sharing information. It's related, but definitely not the same as censorship.
    - mjburgess 10y ago
      The problem is this treats the government as a single entity with a uniform will: yes, if you do that, then the government is merely failing to act rather than deliberately censoring anything. However the government isnt a single entity, it is many smaller kingdoms. And The King is censoring one of his princes internally: preventing the EPA from releasing data it would like to.
      - nebabyte 10y ago
        We're not a fucking monarchy. The entirety of the executive branch serves at the pleasure of the president. And he's entirely within his rights to shut programs down; that isn't censorship. Learn your definitions lest you serve as a strawman for the other side of the argument.
        mjburgess 10y ago
        The president censored the staff of the EPA, that's true whichever picture you take.
        nebabyte 10y ago
        Incorrect, if you define of 'censorship' as the illegal suppression of information, as I and others do. Any structural changes (including withholding information - or will you no longer complacently consent to living under a system wherein secret classifications exist?) are entirely legal, and so not 'censorship'. I'm not saying I agree with the idea, but the system you're in does not magically adapt to suit your ideals in any given system. If you're not going to understand it well enough to understand where it needs to change, you're just going to be a waste of time for anyone wishing to discuss means to do so, and so not worth engaging for those people.
        mjburgess 10y ago
        Yes, if you define it to suit your point. But that's not the meaning of the term.
        nebabyte 10y ago
        Censorship is illegal suppression of information. You can tell your kids to shut up, that isn't censoring them. You try and choose a meaning to support your argument just as much as anyone else does. Welcome to terminology.
    - enraged_camel 10y ago
      >>Not releasing information is different than banning people from sharing information. Lying by omission is still lying. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#Lying_by_omission https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#Lying_by_omission
  - nickodell 10y ago
    First Amendment law makes this distinction. https://www.popehat.com/2017/01/25/quick-cheat-sheet-on-first-amendment-rights-of-public-employees/ https://www.popehat.com/2017/01/25/quick-cheat-sheet-on-firs...
- cryptarch 10y ago
  Censorship is the suppression of undesirable information. Data on climate change is now being suppressed because it is undesirable to the POTUS. The US Gov. has many branches and is not one consistent entity. The administration choosing the censor other branches is censorship. A = A

candiodari 10y ago

Important caveat: the US government is reducing it's own efforts to combat climate change. That's not censorship.

sverhagen 10y ago
I've read through a few definitions of the word "censorship", just now, and I don't think any of them make this particular distinction.
- briandear 10y ago
  There is a distinction between open government and censorship. Not releasing information is different than banning people from sharing information. It's related, but definitely not the same as censorship.
  - mjburgess 10y ago
    The problem is this treats the government as a single entity with a uniform will: yes, if you do that, then the government is merely failing to act rather than deliberately censoring anything. However the government isnt a single entity, it is many smaller kingdoms. And The King is censoring one of his princes internally: preventing the EPA from releasing data it would like to.
    - nebabyte 10y ago
      We're not a fucking monarchy. The entirety of the executive branch serves at the pleasure of the president. And he's entirely within his rights to shut programs down; that isn't censorship. Learn your definitions lest you serve as a strawman for the other side of the argument.
      - mjburgess 10y ago
        The president censored the staff of the EPA, that's true whichever picture you take.
        nebabyte 10y ago
        Incorrect, if you define of 'censorship' as the illegal suppression of information, as I and others do. Any structural changes (including withholding information - or will you no longer complacently consent to living under a system wherein secret classifications exist?) are entirely legal, and so not 'censorship'. I'm not saying I agree with the idea, but the system you're in does not magically adapt to suit your ideals in any given system. If you're not going to understand it well enough to understand where it needs to change, you're just going to be a waste of time for anyone wishing to discuss means to do so, and so not worth engaging for those people.
        mjburgess 10y ago
        Yes, if you define it to suit your point. But that's not the meaning of the term.
        nebabyte 10y ago
        Censorship is illegal suppression of information. You can tell your kids to shut up, that isn't censoring them. You try and choose a meaning to support your argument just as much as anyone else does. Welcome to terminology.
  - enraged_camel 10y ago
    >>Not releasing information is different than banning people from sharing information. Lying by omission is still lying. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#Lying_by_omission https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#Lying_by_omission
- nickodell 10y ago
  First Amendment law makes this distinction. https://www.popehat.com/2017/01/25/quick-cheat-sheet-on-first-amendment-rights-of-public-employees/ https://www.popehat.com/2017/01/25/quick-cheat-sheet-on-firs...
cryptarch 10y ago
Censorship is the suppression of undesirable information. Data on climate change is now being suppressed because it is undesirable to the POTUS. The US Gov. has many branches and is not one consistent entity. The administration choosing the censor other branches is censorship. A = A