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Only when one doesn't know someone's sex. In the case of Mr. Wisenberg, one does. And you're completely ignoring my substantive point that the fact that someo
by zeveb 10y ago
Only when one doesn't know someone's sex. In the case of Mr. Wisenberg, one does.
And you're completely ignoring my substantive point that the fact that someone is technically a criminal does not mean that he actually deserves the full force and power of the State to bear down on him.
- tptacek 10y agoRespectfully, that is a rule you just made up.
- zeveb 10y agoFrom your own Wikipedia link: 'It typically occurs with an antecedent of indeterminate gender,' meaning that use with an antecedent of determinate gender is atypical. From the same page: 'In some situations, an individual may be known but referred to using the pronoun they. This may occur because the individual's gender is unknown to the speaker, or because the gender is non-binary or genderqueer, so that they regard both masculine and feminine pronouns as inappropriate and thus prefer to be referred to as they.' Mr. Wisenberg's gender is known and he presents as a man in his profile; there is no reason to use 'they' instead of 'he,' and thus it's simply wrong to do so. I don't think you intended to be rude to him by failing to use the correct pronoun, but I believe you were. And, again, you continue to ignore the substantive point.
- tptacek 10y agoI think you're responding to the wrong commenter. I didn't provide you with a Wikipedia link. The rest of your comment, which amounts to a rule saying "the singular they is okay but only as a last resort", is incorrect. Singular "they" is correct even with a known gender†. I can, of course, back this up with cites, but at this point you're going to have bet me $100 (charity of your choice) that you're right to make me continue along this tiresome tangent. † (in my case: I used "they" because I didn't know or care to learn the gender).
- maxlybbert 10y agoI used to hold the line on "the correct pronoun for any person you do not know is female is 'he'" until I saw a list similar to what tptacek linked to (I think in the book Style: Toward Clarity and Grace). Singular "they" has been used for centuries. Chaucer used it. It wasn't always meticulously used to identify people who don't fit into traditional gender roles. "He" is certainly acceptable for "person without identifying gender," but so is "they."
- vacri 10y agoThe OP just said 'criminal', nothing about 'full force and power of the State'. Few criminals actually get that.
- nsaslideface 10y agoWhat is the use of sex-specific pronouns, outside the context of men's multi-millennia oppression of women?