4 ms·

> We've got Americans who need jobs. Well, that's all nice and stuff but you're wrong. Firstly, if you're good at your job, you wouldn't need to be concerned.

by dm3730 10y ago

> We've got Americans who need jobs. Well, that's all nice and stuff but you're wrong. Firstly, if you're good at your job, you wouldn't need to be concerned. Secondly, you weren't concerned when all those manufacturing and blue collar jobs went to Mexico. What about when all those chemical plants and electronics/assembly/everything else moved to China? No sir, you weren't concerned at all. In fact, you enjoyed the lower prices that brought you. You didn't care about those factory workers in Flint. Why should your job be any different? Why shouldn't corporations be allowed to do whatever they need to do to deliver better shareholder profits and lower prices to their customers? America needs profits, not jobs! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pp6-VLpWgRo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pp6-VLpWgRo

ebola1717 10y ago
Not to mention that technology has always been a bigger displacer of jobs than immigration. H1B allows 65K immigrants per year. Much more than that is displaced by self-driving cars, warehouse automation, etc.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > H1B allows 65K immigrants per year. H-1B allows zero immigrants per year, because it's a non-immigrant visa.
  - ganeshkrishnan 10y ago
    This is nitpicking. And h1b is dual intent anyway so they are classified as immigrants
    - dragonwriter 10y ago
      No, dual intent visas are non-immigrant Visa that don't prohibit entrants from having the intent to apply for immigration under some other provision. (Regular non-immigrant visa prohibit intent to seek immigrant status.)
  - akhilcacharya 10y ago
    It is dual intent for a reason. It's why my parents are citizens, in fact (and by extension, myself).
    - calvinbhai 10y ago
      your parents were lucky. Any indian starting a green card process now, will be staring at a 20+ yr duration to get one. So, at least for India born people, it should be considered as a non-immigrant visa.
  - salasrod 10y ago
    You are wrong, the H1B is a Dual intent visa, which means it can be used by non-immigrants as well as people trying to immigrate into the country.
    - dragonwriter 10y ago
      Dual intent visas are non-immigrant visas for which it is not a violation of the visa terms for the applicant to intend to immigrate at the time they apply for and enter on the non-immigrant visa. (Non-dual-intent non-immigrant visas do not allow this, and immigration officials can and will exclude you from entry with such a visa if they believe you plan to become an immigrant.) They remain, however, non-immigrant visas, and require a separate application for immigration, which is what allows immigration by the quotas applicable to the basis of immigration under which you apply, not the status under the dual-intent visa and it's quota.
      - hiram112 10y ago
        You don't know what you're talking about. It's 85000 per year at 3 year visas x 2 renewals. Then they are able to apply for a green card. The current estimate is that over a million H1bs (not counting those who've gotten green cards) working pridominantly in IT, nursing, and pharmacy. This has destroyed wages and working conditions in these fields.
        dragonwriter 10y ago
        > You don't know what you're talking about. Yes, I do. > It's 85000 per year at 3 year visas x 2 renewals. Yes, but that's not immigration, it's a temporary, guest worker status on a non-immigrant visa. And actually it's more than 85,000/year, since campus H-1Bs are uncapped. The highest recent year I find records for is 162,000 in 2014. > Then they are able to apply for a green card. Actually, they can apply at any time, but they have to meet the requirements for the immigrant Visa category under which they apply and fit within it's quota. H-1B, therefore, adds nothing to immigration limits since anyone who immigrates after an H-1B does so within the quota for the visa under which they immigrate. (For post H-1B employment-based immigration, that's usually EB-1, EB-2 or EB-3.) > The current estimate is that over a million H1bs (not counting those who've gotten green cards) working pridominantly in IT, nursing, and pharmacy. Given the 6-year limit and the number issued each year, it's mathematically impossible for there to be over a million H-1B workers in the country. Those estimates, therefore, are wrong.
reaperducer 10y ago
> Firstly, if you're good at your job, you wouldn't need to be concerned. You sound young. When you get older you'll find out that ability is only tangentially related to keeping one's job.
- dm3730 10y ago
  > You sound young. When you get older you'll find out that ability is only tangentially related to keeping one's job. You sound cynical and used a lazy argument. Can you justify the parent poster's demand that Americans be provided with jobs? How about justifying horse trainers demanding that the car industry be stopped?

by dm3730 10y ago

ebola1717 10y ago

Not to mention that technology has always been a bigger displacer of jobs than immigration. H1B allows 65K immigrants per year. Much more than that is displaced by self-driving cars, warehouse automation, etc.

dragonwriter 10y ago
> H1B allows 65K immigrants per year. H-1B allows zero immigrants per year, because it's a non-immigrant visa.
- ganeshkrishnan 10y ago
  This is nitpicking. And h1b is dual intent anyway so they are classified as immigrants
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
    No, dual intent visas are non-immigrant Visa that don't prohibit entrants from having the intent to apply for immigration under some other provision. (Regular non-immigrant visa prohibit intent to seek immigrant status.)
- akhilcacharya 10y ago
  It is dual intent for a reason. It's why my parents are citizens, in fact (and by extension, myself).
  - calvinbhai 10y ago
    your parents were lucky. Any indian starting a green card process now, will be staring at a 20+ yr duration to get one. So, at least for India born people, it should be considered as a non-immigrant visa.
- salasrod 10y ago
  You are wrong, the H1B is a Dual intent visa, which means it can be used by non-immigrants as well as people trying to immigrate into the country.
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
    Dual intent visas are non-immigrant visas for which it is not a violation of the visa terms for the applicant to intend to immigrate at the time they apply for and enter on the non-immigrant visa. (Non-dual-intent non-immigrant visas do not allow this, and immigration officials can and will exclude you from entry with such a visa if they believe you plan to become an immigrant.) They remain, however, non-immigrant visas, and require a separate application for immigration, which is what allows immigration by the quotas applicable to the basis of immigration under which you apply, not the status under the dual-intent visa and it's quota.
    - hiram112 10y ago
      You don't know what you're talking about. It's 85000 per year at 3 year visas x 2 renewals. Then they are able to apply for a green card. The current estimate is that over a million H1bs (not counting those who've gotten green cards) working pridominantly in IT, nursing, and pharmacy. This has destroyed wages and working conditions in these fields.
      - dragonwriter 10y ago
        > You don't know what you're talking about. Yes, I do. > It's 85000 per year at 3 year visas x 2 renewals. Yes, but that's not immigration, it's a temporary, guest worker status on a non-immigrant visa. And actually it's more than 85,000/year, since campus H-1Bs are uncapped. The highest recent year I find records for is 162,000 in 2014. > Then they are able to apply for a green card. Actually, they can apply at any time, but they have to meet the requirements for the immigrant Visa category under which they apply and fit within it's quota. H-1B, therefore, adds nothing to immigration limits since anyone who immigrates after an H-1B does so within the quota for the visa under which they immigrate. (For post H-1B employment-based immigration, that's usually EB-1, EB-2 or EB-3.) > The current estimate is that over a million H1bs (not counting those who've gotten green cards) working pridominantly in IT, nursing, and pharmacy. Given the 6-year limit and the number issued each year, it's mathematically impossible for there to be over a million H-1B workers in the country. Those estimates, therefore, are wrong.

reaperducer 10y ago

> Firstly, if you're good at your job, you wouldn't need to be concerned. You sound young. When you get older you'll find out that ability is only tangentially related to keeping one's job.

dm3730 10y ago
> You sound young. When you get older you'll find out that ability is only tangentially related to keeping one's job. You sound cynical and used a lazy argument. Can you justify the parent poster's demand that Americans be provided with jobs? How about justifying horse trainers demanding that the car industry be stopped?