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To save you the digging, the chips are Xilink VU9p UltraScale series : https://www.xilinx.com/products/silicon-devices/fpga/virtex-ultrascale-plus.html https:/

To save you the digging, the chips are Xilink VU9p UltraScale series : https://www.xilinx.com/products/silicon-devices/fpga/virtex-ultrascale-plus.html https://www.xilinx.com/products/silicon-devices/fpga/virtex-... (retracted, can't find exact part on digikey) Quantity 1 pricing is about $2000/chip ; however, that price would no doubt drop substantially at even a 1000 chip order. A typical discount (appears to be) 20% at qty 100; so at qty 1000, maybe 33%? So 1 of these chips might be $1200 after you figure a bunch of other discounts? EDIT: https://www.xilinx.com/products/silicon-devices/fpga/virtex-ultrascale-plus.html#productTable https://www.xilinx.com/products/silicon-devices/fpga/virtex-... ^^^ the product table. The XCVU9P is listed as having ~6800 DSP slices, 2,2586K (= ~2.5 million) of system logic cells. That pretty much matches what Amazon describes as them using. (The DDR-4 RAM is external - so it doesn't help narrow down the device.) However there are multiple, very similarly named parts, and it doesn't seem that the XCVU9P is listed on Digikey. Other parts named UltraScale are - thus the confusion.

aseipp 10y ago
These aren't the basic VU9x's. The specs put them somewhere around the highest end card on that series: the XCVU37P, with 64GB DDR4 and 2.8 million cells/7k DSPs. That isn't a $2k card attached over fabric... It's probably closer to a $40,000 card.
- patrickg_zill 10y ago
  I didn't find that in the AWS docs. Can you point me to where this is mentioned?
  - aseipp 10y ago
    https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/instance-types/ https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/instance-types/, ctrl+f "F1". They're vague about the exact part number (none of the listed Xilinx parts perfectly match, so it's likely they got first run of these specific parts or something[1], the prices are just eyeballing based on the listed parts page), but the basic specs are there including the RAM, DSP and logic elements. [1] Xilinx also released Vivado 2017.1 today which is required for these UltraScale+ Virtex devices, so I'm assuming this isn't a coincidence.
- nickpsecurity 10y ago
  I thought they'd be in the thousands but $40,000!? Holy crap! Is there a good reference you have breaking down the families, sizes, and prices all in one place?
  - aseipp 10y ago
    Not really, I sort of just ballparked it (pulled it out of my ass) based on the available numbers you can get from some vendors like Digikey, or Arrow. Go search out the UltraScale+ Virtex devices there, in individual quantities, and they'll range in the $20k space easily at the higher end.[1] These particular cards seem to be otherwise unobtainable and the series isn't exactly listed anywhere I can see. They're clearly at the high end, close to those listed ones, though. Plus, and someone correct me, because I could be very, very wrong -- those $20k numbers are only for the literal chips you get, I think, not counting the actual necessary "surrounding" device. You get surface mounts. So the actual connecting fabric and everything is going to drive the price up even higher. That said, I doubt Amazon is obviously paying $30-40k a device... I bet they get absurd margins at these rates. Just the lowly individual purchasers would pay that price. (Aside from just literally buying in huge quantity, there's probably some element where they can say "We are Amazon, give us deals.") [1] https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/embedded-fpgas-field-programmable-gate-array/696?k=UltraScale&k=&pkeyword=UltraScale&s=49173&FV=ffe002b8%2Cfffc007a%2Cfffc01d3&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25 https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/...
    - Tom1971 10y ago
      Digikey is a terrible price indicator though. A good first order estimate for FPGAs is a factor of 10 between digikey pricing and volume price.
- bisrig 10y ago
  I think the parent comment to yours (or at least the edited version) is right, they are almost surely XCVU9Ps based on the logic element and DSP counts. The ram numbers listed in the product table are embedded memories (BlockRAMs in Xilinx-speak), DDR4 wouldn't be a spec-feature of the FPGA as it's external to the part on the PCB. Avnet web pricing is $27k for the -1 speed grade, extended (not industrial) with 12-week lead. Safe to say Amazon is getting a better deal on both counts. I suspect the add-in card itself is either this or something similar to it, based on specs etc. http://www.bittware.com/xilinx/product/xupp3r/ http://www.bittware.com/xilinx/product/xupp3r/. I didn't see pricing info readily available for that, but a similar card with less on-board DDR4 runs about $7k straight from Xilinx: https://www.xilinx.com/products/boards-and-kits/ek-u1-vcu118-es1-g.html https://www.xilinx.com/products/boards-and-kits/ek-u1-vcu118... Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot to add: I thought it was funny that Amazon's page referred to "logic elements" given that this was traditionally an Altera term - Xilinx preferred/prefers "logic cells".
  - aseipp 10y ago
    Thanks for your correction, you're totally right. I have no idea why I confused BRAMs with DDR4 on the board...
anigbrowl 10y ago
Yeah, I too was mystified that they didn't bother to mention this on the landing page, or even explain what it is for newbies who are unfamiliar with FPGAs.
- Cyph0n 10y ago
  If you don't know what an FPGA is, you are probably not going to be able to do much with one. It's kind of like expecting the Ubuntu homepage to explain what Linux is, or the Django website to explain what Python is.
  - nickpsecurity 10y ago
    I agree with you. It's a complex topic that takes a long time to learn and use effectively. It costs plenty of money. We don't need a site on development kits aimed at practitioners to explain the basics of what they are. We have other sites for that.
    - femto 10y ago
      > It costs plenty of money. Not for the entry level. The Icestorm [1] tools are free software, in every sense of the word, and can take you all the way from Verilog source (or VHDL using GHDL's analyser [2]) to a bitstream. An associated board, such as an iCEstick or iCE40-HX8K, costs $40 downwards. (Cheap enough that a friendly sales rep. gave me one for free on request.) [1] http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ [2] https://github.com/tgingold/ghdlsynth-beta https://github.com/tgingold/ghdlsynth-beta
      - nickpsecurity 10y ago
        The project is about AWS's using high-end FPGA's. It's going to assume they have money and already learned the stuff since they pay as they go. Whereas, for a page on introducing FPGA's, what you referenced would be good stuff to have on it. Especially in addition to Spartan boards or list of cheap kits. Again, this isn't an introduction.
mng2 10y ago
That pricing sounds waaaay too low to me; these are big, cutting edge parts, basically unobtainium at the moment unless you have a close relationship with Xilinx. When they reach the channel they will not be cheap either. https://octopart.com/search?q=xcvu9p https://octopart.com/search?q=xcvu9p
- patrickg_zill 10y ago
  I checked pricing for qty 1 via digikey.com in USD, choosing the part that was about $2k as it seemed closest to the specs I could find mentioned in the joint Xilinx/Amazon announcement .
  - duskwuff 10y ago
    You must have been comparing to something else entirely! The cheapest Ultrascale part that Digi-Key carries is XCVU065 at $6800, and that isn't even in the right part family.
    - aseipp 10y ago
      Might have been confused by the part number; I think the Kintex series is closer to the $2k range, so that might be the confusing culprit.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
ktta 10y ago
Pricing is incorrect. Here's how it looks[1], with further links to the product down the comment chain. The picture I posted there has the exact product's picture with the correct specs. I don't remember the exact pricing but I think it was about $9k [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074537 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074537

aseipp 10y ago

These aren't the basic VU9x's. The specs put them somewhere around the highest end card on that series: the XCVU37P, with 64GB DDR4 and 2.8 million cells/7k DSPs. That isn't a $2k card attached over fabric... It's probably closer to a $40,000 card.

patrickg_zill 10y ago
I didn't find that in the AWS docs. Can you point me to where this is mentioned?
- aseipp 10y ago
  https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/instance-types/ https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/instance-types/, ctrl+f "F1". They're vague about the exact part number (none of the listed Xilinx parts perfectly match, so it's likely they got first run of these specific parts or something[1], the prices are just eyeballing based on the listed parts page), but the basic specs are there including the RAM, DSP and logic elements. [1] Xilinx also released Vivado 2017.1 today which is required for these UltraScale+ Virtex devices, so I'm assuming this isn't a coincidence.
nickpsecurity 10y ago
I thought they'd be in the thousands but $40,000!? Holy crap! Is there a good reference you have breaking down the families, sizes, and prices all in one place?
- aseipp 10y ago
  Not really, I sort of just ballparked it (pulled it out of my ass) based on the available numbers you can get from some vendors like Digikey, or Arrow. Go search out the UltraScale+ Virtex devices there, in individual quantities, and they'll range in the $20k space easily at the higher end.[1] These particular cards seem to be otherwise unobtainable and the series isn't exactly listed anywhere I can see. They're clearly at the high end, close to those listed ones, though. Plus, and someone correct me, because I could be very, very wrong -- those $20k numbers are only for the literal chips you get, I think, not counting the actual necessary "surrounding" device. You get surface mounts. So the actual connecting fabric and everything is going to drive the price up even higher. That said, I doubt Amazon is obviously paying $30-40k a device... I bet they get absurd margins at these rates. Just the lowly individual purchasers would pay that price. (Aside from just literally buying in huge quantity, there's probably some element where they can say "We are Amazon, give us deals.") [1] https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/embedded-fpgas-field-programmable-gate-array/696?k=UltraScale&k=&pkeyword=UltraScale&s=49173&FV=ffe002b8%2Cfffc007a%2Cfffc01d3&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25 https://www.digikey.com/products/en/integrated-circuits-ics/...
  - Tom1971 10y ago
    Digikey is a terrible price indicator though. A good first order estimate for FPGAs is a factor of 10 between digikey pricing and volume price.
bisrig 10y ago
I think the parent comment to yours (or at least the edited version) is right, they are almost surely XCVU9Ps based on the logic element and DSP counts. The ram numbers listed in the product table are embedded memories (BlockRAMs in Xilinx-speak), DDR4 wouldn't be a spec-feature of the FPGA as it's external to the part on the PCB. Avnet web pricing is $27k for the -1 speed grade, extended (not industrial) with 12-week lead. Safe to say Amazon is getting a better deal on both counts. I suspect the add-in card itself is either this or something similar to it, based on specs etc. http://www.bittware.com/xilinx/product/xupp3r/ http://www.bittware.com/xilinx/product/xupp3r/. I didn't see pricing info readily available for that, but a similar card with less on-board DDR4 runs about $7k straight from Xilinx: https://www.xilinx.com/products/boards-and-kits/ek-u1-vcu118-es1-g.html https://www.xilinx.com/products/boards-and-kits/ek-u1-vcu118... Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot to add: I thought it was funny that Amazon's page referred to "logic elements" given that this was traditionally an Altera term - Xilinx preferred/prefers "logic cells".
- aseipp 10y ago
  Thanks for your correction, you're totally right. I have no idea why I confused BRAMs with DDR4 on the board...

anigbrowl 10y ago

Yeah, I too was mystified that they didn't bother to mention this on the landing page, or even explain what it is for newbies who are unfamiliar with FPGAs.

Cyph0n 10y ago
If you don't know what an FPGA is, you are probably not going to be able to do much with one. It's kind of like expecting the Ubuntu homepage to explain what Linux is, or the Django website to explain what Python is.
- nickpsecurity 10y ago
  I agree with you. It's a complex topic that takes a long time to learn and use effectively. It costs plenty of money. We don't need a site on development kits aimed at practitioners to explain the basics of what they are. We have other sites for that.
  - femto 10y ago
    > It costs plenty of money. Not for the entry level. The Icestorm [1] tools are free software, in every sense of the word, and can take you all the way from Verilog source (or VHDL using GHDL's analyser [2]) to a bitstream. An associated board, such as an iCEstick or iCE40-HX8K, costs $40 downwards. (Cheap enough that a friendly sales rep. gave me one for free on request.) [1] http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ [2] https://github.com/tgingold/ghdlsynth-beta https://github.com/tgingold/ghdlsynth-beta
    - nickpsecurity 10y ago
      The project is about AWS's using high-end FPGA's. It's going to assume they have money and already learned the stuff since they pay as they go. Whereas, for a page on introducing FPGA's, what you referenced would be good stuff to have on it. Especially in addition to Spartan boards or list of cheap kits. Again, this isn't an introduction.

mng2 10y ago

That pricing sounds waaaay too low to me; these are big, cutting edge parts, basically unobtainium at the moment unless you have a close relationship with Xilinx. When they reach the channel they will not be cheap either. https://octopart.com/search?q=xcvu9p https://octopart.com/search?q=xcvu9p

patrickg_zill 10y ago
I checked pricing for qty 1 via digikey.com in USD, choosing the part that was about $2k as it seemed closest to the specs I could find mentioned in the joint Xilinx/Amazon announcement .
- duskwuff 10y ago
  You must have been comparing to something else entirely! The cheapest Ultrascale part that Digi-Key carries is XCVU065 at $6800, and that isn't even in the right part family.
  - aseipp 10y ago
    Might have been confused by the part number; I think the Kintex series is closer to the $2k range, so that might be the confusing culprit.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

ktta 10y ago

Pricing is incorrect. Here's how it looks[1], with further links to the product down the comment chain. The picture I posted there has the exact product's picture with the correct specs. I don't remember the exact pricing but I think it was about $9k [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074537 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074537