7 ms·

IPV6 solves this, plus even without you don't need anything close to this amount of IPs to do what you're describing. It's a fairly niche case to need that many

by dangero 10y ago

IPV6 solves this, plus even without you don't need anything close to this amount of IPs to do what you're describing. It's a fairly niche case to need that many public IPs and it seems a little crazy to hold that many just in case some researcher might want to use them. Even your comment about streaming, seems like mainly nostalgia vs reality as you kind of admit. Any modern streaming infrastructure works from behind a NAT since most people are behind one these days.

flyinghamster 10y ago
I've tried to run IPv6 on my Comcast connection. Unsurprisingly, Comcast doesn't get the point of IPv6. They allocate one single IPv6 address to my router. That's right, ONE. LOUSY. ADDRESS. This seems to be a "feature" of owning your own modem rather than renting one of theirs. I hesitate to even try to get this fixed via their tech support. I guess if I want IPv6 connectivity, I'm either going to have to get a tunnel from Hurricane Electric (SIXXS is shutting down), or carve out some IPv6 space from my Linode and tunnel it to my home network.
- jagger27 10y ago
  Rogers in Canada gives /64, which is lovely.
  - lokedhs 10y ago
    My old ISP gave me a /64 and it was anything but lovely. It's too small to break up into subnets, and they were unable to give anything larger. This caused me to switch ISP's and now I have a static /48. That's much nicer.
- buzer 10y ago
  That doesn't sound correct. Are you absolutely sure you aren't also getting a prefix delegation thru DHCPv6? That's currently the common way to provide IPv6 connectivity currently for residential users. From what I remember hearing, Comcast was giving /60s thru PD.
  - flyinghamster 10y ago
    No, I don't get a prefix. No /60, no /64, not even a /120, just one single address. A /128. Maybe I should jump on their forums and raise a fuss. I'm not at all confident that calling tech support would get me to someone who even had a clue what IPv6 is.
    - kiallmacinnes 10y ago
      Just to be sure, with a routed network being aimed at your house, you'll actually receive two subnets (well, a single address in one subnet, and a whole second subnet). You need to use DHCP-PD or similar to make use of it. The /128 sounds perfectly normal, and is used as a "point to point" link between the ISP and your modem. Over this, DHCP prefix delegation typically gives you a whole second subnet of /60 or so. If your modem isn't handling DHCP-PD, then all your see is 1 measly address even though they've likely allocated and pushed 295,147,905,179,352,825,856 addresses to you.
      - flyinghamster 10y ago
        Hmmm, maybe I should revisit this. I first tried it a year or so ago with pfSense on a virtual machine. Between the IPv6 issues and generally poor performance (long story), I went back to my IPv4-only configuration with DD-WRT on a D-Link DIR-825. I'm now using a Ubiquiti EdgeRouter POE, and maybe I should give it another shot. I'm not convinced I'll actually get a prefix from Comcast, though.
        mjcl 10y ago
        It may differ by region, but in the SF Bay Area I've been getting a /60 from Comcast residential for a few years now using a MikroTik router. See here: http://i.imgur.com/2mrRk01.png http://i.imgur.com/2mrRk01.png
        kiallmacinnes 10y ago
        The edge router can do DHCP-PD, but it needs some configuration for it to do it, there's lots of info on the Ubuiquiti forums about it. Good luck!
- geraldcombs 10y ago
  You should be able to get a /56 or /60 from them using DHCPV6-PD.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- apaprocki 10y ago
  Not necessarily your situation -- but I noticed this from Time Warner as well and it turned out to be my old Airport Extreme hardware. Even with the latest firmware it wouldn't receive the delegated range. As soon as I upgraded to the latest model, it properly received a delegated range from TWC without me doing anything else. Just saying, there is a lot of reason to hate cable companies, but it's not always their fault :)
- VLM 10y ago
  "carve out some IPv6 space from my Linode and tunnel it to my home network." I'm planning on doing exactly this using openvpn as my transport (because I already have an extensive ipv4 openvpn system). Has anyone tried it? I'm not interested so much in how to do it, which I think I know, but in anecdotes along the lines of "it makes openvpn crash" or "linode told me I was being abusive and cut me off" or whatever. I've had ipv6 for decades I guess. I even got one of the Hurricane Electric "sage" tee shirts last decade. But when sixxs goes down I lose ipv6 connectivity for the first time since the DSL days at the turn of the century.
  - apostacy 10y ago
    I tunnel all of my traffic through my Linode. I had to disable ipv6, because I was getting constant captcha checks from facebook, cloudflare, and google. No matter how many different ipv6 addresses I tried, traffic is always marked as suspicious. As soon as I disabled ipv6, everything went smoothly.
    - kiallmacinnes 10y ago
      This sounds like CloudFlare etc have just blacklisted hosting provider IPv6 blocks, as there a real easy way to get millions of "clean" IPs priced by the hour. CloudFlare etc certainly dont do this with SiXXS IPv6 addresses, or any traditional residential provider I'm aware of.
      - apostacy 10y ago
        Well, I'd love to use ipv6. In fact, I can't wait. But, what am I supposed to do? * T-mobile: ipv4 * Office: ipv4 * Verizon: ipv4 * University: ipv4 * Linode: ipv6 (but flagged as hostile) Google will not just show me captchas, but will deactivate accounts if I use some of their apis. I had to reverify several accounts when I've tried using ipv6. I'm not being backward about ipv4, I'm really not. But we're in denial about the fact that we still live in an ipv4 world. And I don't like seeing the last vestiges of non-profit ipv4 address space being liquidated.
- ajross 10y ago
  Actually, Comcast supports DHCP prefix delegation (I'm led to believe everywhere, but it works at my home anyway), which is pretty much the Right Thing in this space. Your default DHCPv6 request is from a single client and it returns a single IP, as expected. And you can then do NAT across that if you want, which is what their default routers do. But if you want a subnet, you can make a second DHCPv6 request with prefix delegation metadata, and the server will establish a route for a full /64 subnet to your existing IP and return it to you. Then you can hand these out however you want (though they won't give you bigger than a /64 so you can do internal subnet routing). The only annoyance is that none of the existing Linux distros support this yet as part of their network client integration, so you have to script it yourself around dhclient (see the -P argument), which is a little hairy if you want to get the hooks right (I punted and just did it once manually and left dhclient running).
  - pedrocr 10y ago
    >The only annoyance is that none of the existing Linux distros support this yet as part of their network client integration, so you have to script it yourself around dhclient (see the -P argument), which is a little hairy if you want to get the hooks right (I punted and just did it once manually and left dhclient running). I think OpenWRT has all you need for this. At least I think that's exactly what I did with my ISP config on my own router just with the LuCi web interface.
  - ihattendorf 10y ago
    Yep, same with Cox in my area. I'm running Sophos UTM Home which supports prefix delegation, I'm sure there are others that are plug and play as well.
  - virtuallynathan 10y ago
    Comcast will give out up to a /60 for residential if you hint for it in DHCPv6-PD.
  - flyinghamster 10y ago
    UPDATE: I now have IPv6 connectivity via my shiny new EdgeRouter POE. Now I just have to poke a few holes in the firewall where appropriate (now that I've set drop-by-default rules). Getting it to work with the ER-POE was non-intuitive but not as bad as I was expecting. I'm even getting a /60...
- eximius 10y ago
  I have Comcast and get a range. It may be a regional thing or your setup is just wonky. Granted, I have business class so that I don't violate their ToS by hosting stuff and to get a dedicated IP.
- scott00 10y ago
  I get a /60 from Comcast in Chicago.
- syncsynchalt 10y ago
  That's surprising, in Denver Comcast gives my Time Capsule a /64 (and has for years, we were one of the earlier areas to get v6 service from them). Doubly surprising since the v6 RFCs all but forbid giving out less than a /64, and Comcast is a leader rather than follower of v6 technology. I wonder if the modem manufacturer is at fault instead. I regularly ssh straight into to my suspended WoL Macbook over v6, and never went out of my way to set up a single bit of it. A half dozen new technologies working perfectly out of the box!
mickrussom 10y ago
IPv6 solves mAAAAny issues. DNS issues causes MAAAAny more. I dAAAAbble in v6 here AAAAnd there AAAAnd the situAAAAtion is still pretty dire.
- runjake 10y ago
  Guy who manages a two-dozen site v6 network with tens of thousands of clients here. What issues are you referring to?
  - knd775 10y ago
    They answered that question 6 times in their comment.
    - mortehu 10y ago
      If you can't access IPv6 enabled sites, you can't access Google, Facebook, Wikipedia, or Netflix, who all enabled IPv6 permanently in 2012[1]. According to [2], around a third of US has IPv6 connectivity. If AAAA records constitute some big problem, it's not well known. 1. http://www.worldipv6launch.org/participants/?q=1 http://www.worldipv6launch.org/participants/?q=1 2. https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html#tab=per-country-ipv6-adoption&tab=per-country-ipv6-adoption https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html#tab=per-...
      - throwaway2048 10y ago
        Thats not how it works, if you only have IPv4, AAAA records have no effect. Google et all continue to work via IPv4.
        mortehu 10y ago
        I'm not sure what you're referring to when you say "Thats not how it works". I was referring to people with broken IPv6 setups, mostly Teredo and 6to4 (old Mac OS X versions), for whom IPv4 worked but IPv6 was not actually routable. At the time, publishing AAAA records would lock out all of those users.
apostacy 10y ago
IPV6 is all well and good, but I am not optimistic about it. Why should a university deploy it, and introduce all sorts of new problems? Mine hasn't. And I don't blame them. No, I think that our future is isolated carrier-grade NAT, connecting to cloud services exclusively. And that makes me sad. I had to disable ipv6 on my Linode, because Clouldflare, Google, and Facebook do not seem to trust any ipv6 traffic coming from Linode. Only using ipv4 has fixed everything. And, as for ip4 blocks being obsolete, I still think it's wrong to sell them off. Universities were endowed with these. If they don't have a use for them, they should make them available for someone who does. Not just sell them to be used for some corporation's infrastructure. I hate how so many people on hackernews seem to think that not selling these ipv4 addresses is a "waste". People are only looking at this in purely financial terms. I consider it to be wasteful to sell them to Microsoft or Amazon or whatever. No matter how much money they offer. Universities are supposed to use the gifts they are given to try to better society. Aren't these ip addresses going to just be used for things like NAT traversal? Why doesn't MIT make them available for some non profit to offer that service as a public utility? If a flight school has an operating runway and hanger, should they just make all their students use flight simulators and demolish their runway? Should an agricultural school sell off their farmland to real estate developers? If their students really weren't benefiting from their property, then they should donate it to some organization that could carry on the spirit of what they were supposed to be doing with it.
- lamontcg 10y ago
  We really need to just pick a date and turn off ipv4 because its the only way to make this guy change.
  - apostacy 10y ago
    It's not me that's fixated on ipv4. I would love ipv6. But why aren't ISPs providing it? Why aren't universities and other large organizations switching to it by default? ISPs don't care. They would rather everyone just use carrier-grade NAT.
    - 10y ago
apostacy 10y ago
> Even your comment about streaming, seems like mainly nostalgia vs reality as you kind of admit. Any modern streaming infrastructure works from behind a NAT since most people are behind one these days. If I tried streaming a conference on youtube, facebook, or periscope, my stream could be muted or stopped because someone plays copyrighted music or something.

by dangero 10y ago

flyinghamster 10y ago

I've tried to run IPv6 on my Comcast connection. Unsurprisingly, Comcast doesn't get the point of IPv6. They allocate one single IPv6 address to my router. That's right, ONE. LOUSY. ADDRESS. This seems to be a "feature" of owning your own modem rather than renting one of theirs. I hesitate to even try to get this fixed via their tech support. I guess if I want IPv6 connectivity, I'm either going to have to get a tunnel from Hurricane Electric (SIXXS is shutting down), or carve out some IPv6 space from my Linode and tunnel it to my home network.

jagger27 10y ago
Rogers in Canada gives /64, which is lovely.
- lokedhs 10y ago
  My old ISP gave me a /64 and it was anything but lovely. It's too small to break up into subnets, and they were unable to give anything larger. This caused me to switch ISP's and now I have a static /48. That's much nicer.
buzer 10y ago
That doesn't sound correct. Are you absolutely sure you aren't also getting a prefix delegation thru DHCPv6? That's currently the common way to provide IPv6 connectivity currently for residential users. From what I remember hearing, Comcast was giving /60s thru PD.
- flyinghamster 10y ago
  No, I don't get a prefix. No /60, no /64, not even a /120, just one single address. A /128. Maybe I should jump on their forums and raise a fuss. I'm not at all confident that calling tech support would get me to someone who even had a clue what IPv6 is.
  - kiallmacinnes 10y ago
    Just to be sure, with a routed network being aimed at your house, you'll actually receive two subnets (well, a single address in one subnet, and a whole second subnet). You need to use DHCP-PD or similar to make use of it. The /128 sounds perfectly normal, and is used as a "point to point" link between the ISP and your modem. Over this, DHCP prefix delegation typically gives you a whole second subnet of /60 or so. If your modem isn't handling DHCP-PD, then all your see is 1 measly address even though they've likely allocated and pushed 295,147,905,179,352,825,856 addresses to you.
    - flyinghamster 10y ago
      Hmmm, maybe I should revisit this. I first tried it a year or so ago with pfSense on a virtual machine. Between the IPv6 issues and generally poor performance (long story), I went back to my IPv4-only configuration with DD-WRT on a D-Link DIR-825. I'm now using a Ubiquiti EdgeRouter POE, and maybe I should give it another shot. I'm not convinced I'll actually get a prefix from Comcast, though.
      - mjcl 10y ago
        It may differ by region, but in the SF Bay Area I've been getting a /60 from Comcast residential for a few years now using a MikroTik router. See here: http://i.imgur.com/2mrRk01.png http://i.imgur.com/2mrRk01.png
      - kiallmacinnes 10y ago
        The edge router can do DHCP-PD, but it needs some configuration for it to do it, there's lots of info on the Ubuiquiti forums about it. Good luck!
geraldcombs 10y ago
You should be able to get a /56 or /60 from them using DHCPV6-PD.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
apaprocki 10y ago
Not necessarily your situation -- but I noticed this from Time Warner as well and it turned out to be my old Airport Extreme hardware. Even with the latest firmware it wouldn't receive the delegated range. As soon as I upgraded to the latest model, it properly received a delegated range from TWC without me doing anything else. Just saying, there is a lot of reason to hate cable companies, but it's not always their fault :)
VLM 10y ago
"carve out some IPv6 space from my Linode and tunnel it to my home network." I'm planning on doing exactly this using openvpn as my transport (because I already have an extensive ipv4 openvpn system). Has anyone tried it? I'm not interested so much in how to do it, which I think I know, but in anecdotes along the lines of "it makes openvpn crash" or "linode told me I was being abusive and cut me off" or whatever. I've had ipv6 for decades I guess. I even got one of the Hurricane Electric "sage" tee shirts last decade. But when sixxs goes down I lose ipv6 connectivity for the first time since the DSL days at the turn of the century.
- apostacy 10y ago
  I tunnel all of my traffic through my Linode. I had to disable ipv6, because I was getting constant captcha checks from facebook, cloudflare, and google. No matter how many different ipv6 addresses I tried, traffic is always marked as suspicious. As soon as I disabled ipv6, everything went smoothly.
  - kiallmacinnes 10y ago
    This sounds like CloudFlare etc have just blacklisted hosting provider IPv6 blocks, as there a real easy way to get millions of "clean" IPs priced by the hour. CloudFlare etc certainly dont do this with SiXXS IPv6 addresses, or any traditional residential provider I'm aware of.
    - apostacy 10y ago
      Well, I'd love to use ipv6. In fact, I can't wait. But, what am I supposed to do? * T-mobile: ipv4 * Office: ipv4 * Verizon: ipv4 * University: ipv4 * Linode: ipv6 (but flagged as hostile) Google will not just show me captchas, but will deactivate accounts if I use some of their apis. I had to reverify several accounts when I've tried using ipv6. I'm not being backward about ipv4, I'm really not. But we're in denial about the fact that we still live in an ipv4 world. And I don't like seeing the last vestiges of non-profit ipv4 address space being liquidated.
ajross 10y ago
Actually, Comcast supports DHCP prefix delegation (I'm led to believe everywhere, but it works at my home anyway), which is pretty much the Right Thing in this space. Your default DHCPv6 request is from a single client and it returns a single IP, as expected. And you can then do NAT across that if you want, which is what their default routers do. But if you want a subnet, you can make a second DHCPv6 request with prefix delegation metadata, and the server will establish a route for a full /64 subnet to your existing IP and return it to you. Then you can hand these out however you want (though they won't give you bigger than a /64 so you can do internal subnet routing). The only annoyance is that none of the existing Linux distros support this yet as part of their network client integration, so you have to script it yourself around dhclient (see the -P argument), which is a little hairy if you want to get the hooks right (I punted and just did it once manually and left dhclient running).
- pedrocr 10y ago
  >The only annoyance is that none of the existing Linux distros support this yet as part of their network client integration, so you have to script it yourself around dhclient (see the -P argument), which is a little hairy if you want to get the hooks right (I punted and just did it once manually and left dhclient running). I think OpenWRT has all you need for this. At least I think that's exactly what I did with my ISP config on my own router just with the LuCi web interface.
- ihattendorf 10y ago
  Yep, same with Cox in my area. I'm running Sophos UTM Home which supports prefix delegation, I'm sure there are others that are plug and play as well.
- virtuallynathan 10y ago
  Comcast will give out up to a /60 for residential if you hint for it in DHCPv6-PD.
- flyinghamster 10y ago
  UPDATE: I now have IPv6 connectivity via my shiny new EdgeRouter POE. Now I just have to poke a few holes in the firewall where appropriate (now that I've set drop-by-default rules). Getting it to work with the ER-POE was non-intuitive but not as bad as I was expecting. I'm even getting a /60...
eximius 10y ago
I have Comcast and get a range. It may be a regional thing or your setup is just wonky. Granted, I have business class so that I don't violate their ToS by hosting stuff and to get a dedicated IP.
scott00 10y ago
I get a /60 from Comcast in Chicago.
syncsynchalt 10y ago
That's surprising, in Denver Comcast gives my Time Capsule a /64 (and has for years, we were one of the earlier areas to get v6 service from them). Doubly surprising since the v6 RFCs all but forbid giving out less than a /64, and Comcast is a leader rather than follower of v6 technology. I wonder if the modem manufacturer is at fault instead. I regularly ssh straight into to my suspended WoL Macbook over v6, and never went out of my way to set up a single bit of it. A half dozen new technologies working perfectly out of the box!

mickrussom 10y ago

IPv6 solves mAAAAny issues. DNS issues causes MAAAAny more. I dAAAAbble in v6 here AAAAnd there AAAAnd the situAAAAtion is still pretty dire.

runjake 10y ago
Guy who manages a two-dozen site v6 network with tens of thousands of clients here. What issues are you referring to?
- knd775 10y ago
  They answered that question 6 times in their comment.
  - mortehu 10y ago
    If you can't access IPv6 enabled sites, you can't access Google, Facebook, Wikipedia, or Netflix, who all enabled IPv6 permanently in 2012[1]. According to [2], around a third of US has IPv6 connectivity. If AAAA records constitute some big problem, it's not well known. 1. http://www.worldipv6launch.org/participants/?q=1 http://www.worldipv6launch.org/participants/?q=1 2. https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html#tab=per-country-ipv6-adoption&tab=per-country-ipv6-adoption https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html#tab=per-...
    - throwaway2048 10y ago
      Thats not how it works, if you only have IPv4, AAAA records have no effect. Google et all continue to work via IPv4.
      - mortehu 10y ago
        I'm not sure what you're referring to when you say "Thats not how it works". I was referring to people with broken IPv6 setups, mostly Teredo and 6to4 (old Mac OS X versions), for whom IPv4 worked but IPv6 was not actually routable. At the time, publishing AAAA records would lock out all of those users.

apostacy 10y ago

IPV6 is all well and good, but I am not optimistic about it. Why should a university deploy it, and introduce all sorts of new problems? Mine hasn't. And I don't blame them. No, I think that our future is isolated carrier-grade NAT, connecting to cloud services exclusively. And that makes me sad. I had to disable ipv6 on my Linode, because Clouldflare, Google, and Facebook do not seem to trust any ipv6 traffic coming from Linode. Only using ipv4 has fixed everything. And, as for ip4 blocks being obsolete, I still think it's wrong to sell them off. Universities were endowed with these. If they don't have a use for them, they should make them available for someone who does. Not just sell them to be used for some corporation's infrastructure. I hate how so many people on hackernews seem to think that not selling these ipv4 addresses is a "waste". People are only looking at this in purely financial terms. I consider it to be wasteful to sell them to Microsoft or Amazon or whatever. No matter how much money they offer. Universities are supposed to use the gifts they are given to try to better society. Aren't these ip addresses going to just be used for things like NAT traversal? Why doesn't MIT make them available for some non profit to offer that service as a public utility? If a flight school has an operating runway and hanger, should they just make all their students use flight simulators and demolish their runway? Should an agricultural school sell off their farmland to real estate developers? If their students really weren't benefiting from their property, then they should donate it to some organization that could carry on the spirit of what they were supposed to be doing with it.

lamontcg 10y ago
We really need to just pick a date and turn off ipv4 because its the only way to make this guy change.
- apostacy 10y ago
  It's not me that's fixated on ipv4. I would love ipv6. But why aren't ISPs providing it? Why aren't universities and other large organizations switching to it by default? ISPs don't care. They would rather everyone just use carrier-grade NAT.
  - 10y ago

apostacy 10y ago

> Even your comment about streaming, seems like mainly nostalgia vs reality as you kind of admit. Any modern streaming infrastructure works from behind a NAT since most people are behind one these days. If I tried streaming a conference on youtube, facebook, or periscope, my stream could be muted or stopped because someone plays copyrighted music or something.