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>I hope their lobbying finds success. Your opinion piece is fine until your last line where you support using the state to ban other people from making the cho

>I hope their lobbying finds success. Your opinion piece is fine until your last line where you support using the state to ban other people from making the choice that you prefer not to make.

ythn 10y ago
> Your opinion piece is fine until your last line where you support using the state to ban other people from making the choice that you prefer not to make. What's wrong with that? Virtually every regulatory law does this. Unless you are arguing that the state should not be able to regulate anything, I don't see why supporting regulations in one industry or another is a bad thing.
67726e 10y ago
How about this: I hope the hotels successfully lobby to enforce existing zoning laws. I don't want my neighbors running a business out of their house. If they break the law, punish them. Simple as that.
- snakeanus 10y ago
  > I don't want my neighbors running a business out of their house Why?
  - WkndTriathlete 10y ago
    Common concerns: * Increased traffic * More noise * Greater odds of criminal activity * Resultant reduction in nearby property values These are not theoretical and are part of the reason why zoning laws exist.
    - sanderjd 10y ago
      Related to most of the above: a lot of people like to know their neighbors so that they can be comfortable talking to them if there's a problem. Full time rentals mess that up. Now you might well find yourself going to complain to a stranger who couldn't care less what you think, and it's a different stranger every weekend.
  - nommm-nommm 10y ago
    http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-airbnb-party-house-glendale-20140106-story.html http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-airbnb-party-hou... >Neighbors of what critics say is a “party house” in the Glenwood community told the Glendale News-Press that the constant partying in the 1300 block of Norton Avenue was interfering with their sleep in the early-morning hours. They said they’d find beer bottles in the street, people fighting on the sidewalk in the early-morning hours, parking clogged and loud music blaring. >Frank Higginbotham, who lives across the street from the house, said he saw tour buses with about 30 people pull up to the residence for a party about two weeks ago. >Earlier in December, neighbors, said, there was one party that had to be shut down using a powerful spotlight from a hovering police helicopter and several police officers. >“This was like a war zone,” he said, adding that parties have been going on every weekend for months. “Every night I came home, I was scared to think about what I was going to find here.”
    - xapata 10y ago
      I'd be amazed if they were violating no laws. Surely the law would help the neighbors regardless of whether or not the party host was an AirBnB.
  - 67726e 10y ago
    Because I live in a residential neighborhood with residential zoning, and I don't want to deal with itinerant neighbors with little regard for the neighborhood. You want to run a B&B? Go through the proper legal channels and build a legitimate business.
dominotw 10y ago
But, we want govt to ensure our safety at work, from the drugs we buy at the pharmacy. An ordinary person doesn't have the tools to verify this information for himself.
- mason240 10y ago
  Then stay in a hotel.
kesselvon 10y ago
Last time I checked, running an unlicensed hotel was still illegal
- xapata 10y ago
  Would you get a haircut from an unlicensed hairdresser?
  - cuckcuckspruce 10y ago
    No. I don't want to get lice or a scalp infection.
    - xapata 10y ago
      I guess I've been lucky so far.
  - kalleboo 10y ago
    In Sweden there is no such thing as hairdresser licensing. I guess I've been at mortal risk all this time!
  - dexterdog 10y ago
    I do it all of the time when I cut my own hair. I cut hair for other people when they ask. I don't charge money, but obviously I am unlicensed.
- kalleboo 10y ago
  What's a hotel though? Where I'm from, running a bed and breakfast (defined as 4 or fewer rooms and 8 or fewer guests) doesn't require any kind of special licensing. Of course running it out of an apartment runs afoul of every rental agreement I've seen.
  - philrapo 10y ago
    A common zoning distinction is that a bed & breakfast is a private home where the host lives in the home. If the host does not live there, many cities/towns would then consider it a hotel and subject it to different rules. I think a lot of the arm waving about airbnb is because of the latter situation. I don't think many people seem to have issues with renting out a spare room.
mdpopescu 10y ago
That is a general rule with prohibitionists. "I don't drink, so nobody else should." "I don't do drugs, so nobody else should."
- cuckcuckspruce 10y ago
  "I don't die in a fire because the short-term rental I stayed at doesn't have a working smoke detector!" Yeah, that's really the prohibitionist mindset there.
  - smokeyj 10y ago
    As opposed to having your rental be burned down by a long-term renter? That's an oddly specific preference..
    - metaphorm 10y ago
      a long term renter has a much greater vested interest in preserving the quality of life of the community and mitigating impact on the neighbors. the fire safety issue is a bit of a red herring. that's something that is the responsibility of the landlord and the local fire safety inspector anyway, not really part of the long term vs short term rental debate. the issues related to ABB tenants are about their lack of responsibility and accountability within the community, since they will be gone (forever) in a short period of time. the issues related to ABB hosts is that they evade regulations that their competitors cannot evade, and that (in some situations) they violate community laws or norms that exist for good reasons.
      - smokeyj 10y ago
        > the fire safety issue is a bit of a red herring. Which was the only point I was making. > that's something that is the responsibility of the landlord So you agree it's red herring because fire safety is already regulated.. > the issues related to ABB tenants are about their lack of responsibility and accountability within the community If I could demonstrate that responsibility and accountability were already regulated in communities - would you agree that your objections are red herring as well?
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
nommm-nommm 10y ago
You can't sell an unsafe car. You can't run an unsafe restaurant. You can't build an unsafe building. You can't rent an unsafe home. You can't drive in an unsafe manner. You can't allow an unsafe number of people in your business. You can't run an unsafe salon. You can't practice medicine in an unsafe manner. You can't sell unsafe food. And you can't run an unsafe hotel.
- tim333 10y ago
  Your usual airbnb property is not "an unsafe hotel." My flat is presently being let on airbnb and isn't suddenly unsafe because someone else is in it rather than me.
  - ryanbrunner 10y ago
    In my experience, the vast (90+%) of Airbnb properties share more in common with a hotel room than an apartment that is occasionally rented out.
    - dang 10y ago
      My experience is the opposite - 90% of the places I've stayed have clearly been people's homes or cottages. At least in the US. In Europe it was different but for me that's a much smaller sample size.
      - drewmate 10y ago
        I have the same experience as yours. Of the 7-8 AirBNBs I have stayed at, only 1 felt like a hotel (it was in Hong Kong, and the cheapest place I could find.) On the other hand, some of my best travel experiences have been eating meals with hosts, staying up talking about life and drinking by a bonfire with hosts, and otherwise getting the authentic AirBNB experience. Of course I wouldn't say that the hotel-type experience isn't out there (it may even be cheaper than hotels) but that's not why I do AirBNB. It would be a shame (both for hosts and guests) to have fewer opportunities like this available.
      - 10y ago

>I hope their lobbying finds success. Your opinion piece is fine until your last line where you support using the state to ban other people from making the choice that you prefer not to make.

ythn 10y ago

> Your opinion piece is fine until your last line where you support using the state to ban other people from making the choice that you prefer not to make. What's wrong with that? Virtually every regulatory law does this. Unless you are arguing that the state should not be able to regulate anything, I don't see why supporting regulations in one industry or another is a bad thing.

67726e 10y ago

How about this: I hope the hotels successfully lobby to enforce existing zoning laws. I don't want my neighbors running a business out of their house. If they break the law, punish them. Simple as that.

snakeanus 10y ago
> I don't want my neighbors running a business out of their house Why?
- WkndTriathlete 10y ago
  Common concerns: * Increased traffic * More noise * Greater odds of criminal activity * Resultant reduction in nearby property values These are not theoretical and are part of the reason why zoning laws exist.
  - sanderjd 10y ago
    Related to most of the above: a lot of people like to know their neighbors so that they can be comfortable talking to them if there's a problem. Full time rentals mess that up. Now you might well find yourself going to complain to a stranger who couldn't care less what you think, and it's a different stranger every weekend.
- nommm-nommm 10y ago
  http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-airbnb-party-house-glendale-20140106-story.html http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-airbnb-party-hou... >Neighbors of what critics say is a “party house” in the Glenwood community told the Glendale News-Press that the constant partying in the 1300 block of Norton Avenue was interfering with their sleep in the early-morning hours. They said they’d find beer bottles in the street, people fighting on the sidewalk in the early-morning hours, parking clogged and loud music blaring. >Frank Higginbotham, who lives across the street from the house, said he saw tour buses with about 30 people pull up to the residence for a party about two weeks ago. >Earlier in December, neighbors, said, there was one party that had to be shut down using a powerful spotlight from a hovering police helicopter and several police officers. >“This was like a war zone,” he said, adding that parties have been going on every weekend for months. “Every night I came home, I was scared to think about what I was going to find here.”
  - xapata 10y ago
    I'd be amazed if they were violating no laws. Surely the law would help the neighbors regardless of whether or not the party host was an AirBnB.
- 67726e 10y ago
  Because I live in a residential neighborhood with residential zoning, and I don't want to deal with itinerant neighbors with little regard for the neighborhood. You want to run a B&B? Go through the proper legal channels and build a legitimate business.

dominotw 10y ago

But, we want govt to ensure our safety at work, from the drugs we buy at the pharmacy. An ordinary person doesn't have the tools to verify this information for himself.

mason240 10y ago
Then stay in a hotel.

kesselvon 10y ago

Last time I checked, running an unlicensed hotel was still illegal

xapata 10y ago
Would you get a haircut from an unlicensed hairdresser?
- cuckcuckspruce 10y ago
  No. I don't want to get lice or a scalp infection.
  - xapata 10y ago
    I guess I've been lucky so far.
- kalleboo 10y ago
  In Sweden there is no such thing as hairdresser licensing. I guess I've been at mortal risk all this time!
- dexterdog 10y ago
  I do it all of the time when I cut my own hair. I cut hair for other people when they ask. I don't charge money, but obviously I am unlicensed.
kalleboo 10y ago
What's a hotel though? Where I'm from, running a bed and breakfast (defined as 4 or fewer rooms and 8 or fewer guests) doesn't require any kind of special licensing. Of course running it out of an apartment runs afoul of every rental agreement I've seen.
- philrapo 10y ago
  A common zoning distinction is that a bed & breakfast is a private home where the host lives in the home. If the host does not live there, many cities/towns would then consider it a hotel and subject it to different rules. I think a lot of the arm waving about airbnb is because of the latter situation. I don't think many people seem to have issues with renting out a spare room.

mdpopescu 10y ago

That is a general rule with prohibitionists. "I don't drink, so nobody else should." "I don't do drugs, so nobody else should."

cuckcuckspruce 10y ago
"I don't die in a fire because the short-term rental I stayed at doesn't have a working smoke detector!" Yeah, that's really the prohibitionist mindset there.
- smokeyj 10y ago
  As opposed to having your rental be burned down by a long-term renter? That's an oddly specific preference..
  - metaphorm 10y ago
    a long term renter has a much greater vested interest in preserving the quality of life of the community and mitigating impact on the neighbors. the fire safety issue is a bit of a red herring. that's something that is the responsibility of the landlord and the local fire safety inspector anyway, not really part of the long term vs short term rental debate. the issues related to ABB tenants are about their lack of responsibility and accountability within the community, since they will be gone (forever) in a short period of time. the issues related to ABB hosts is that they evade regulations that their competitors cannot evade, and that (in some situations) they violate community laws or norms that exist for good reasons.
    - smokeyj 10y ago
      > the fire safety issue is a bit of a red herring. Which was the only point I was making. > that's something that is the responsibility of the landlord So you agree it's red herring because fire safety is already regulated.. > the issues related to ABB tenants are about their lack of responsibility and accountability within the community If I could demonstrate that responsibility and accountability were already regulated in communities - would you agree that your objections are red herring as well?

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

nommm-nommm 10y ago

You can't sell an unsafe car. You can't run an unsafe restaurant. You can't build an unsafe building. You can't rent an unsafe home. You can't drive in an unsafe manner. You can't allow an unsafe number of people in your business. You can't run an unsafe salon. You can't practice medicine in an unsafe manner. You can't sell unsafe food. And you can't run an unsafe hotel.

tim333 10y ago
Your usual airbnb property is not "an unsafe hotel." My flat is presently being let on airbnb and isn't suddenly unsafe because someone else is in it rather than me.
- ryanbrunner 10y ago
  In my experience, the vast (90+%) of Airbnb properties share more in common with a hotel room than an apartment that is occasionally rented out.
  - dang 10y ago
    My experience is the opposite - 90% of the places I've stayed have clearly been people's homes or cottages. At least in the US. In Europe it was different but for me that's a much smaller sample size.
    - drewmate 10y ago
      I have the same experience as yours. Of the 7-8 AirBNBs I have stayed at, only 1 felt like a hotel (it was in Hong Kong, and the cheapest place I could find.) On the other hand, some of my best travel experiences have been eating meals with hosts, staying up talking about life and drinking by a bonfire with hosts, and otherwise getting the authentic AirBNB experience. Of course I wouldn't say that the hotel-type experience isn't out there (it may even be cheaper than hotels) but that's not why I do AirBNB. It would be a shame (both for hosts and guests) to have fewer opportunities like this available.
    - 10y ago