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> It can't be just me that understand the difference between internal and external. It's not just you. But it's a very select few apparently that understand t

by phil21 10y ago

> It can't be just me that understand the difference between internal and external. It's not just you. But it's a very select few apparently that understand this. If the NSA exists, the entire point of it existing is to spy on foreign countries - allied or not. The only legitimate argument if you're against this is if you feel the NSA and CIA should not exist at all. I will say you are incredibly naive if you say no, but will allow for reasonable people to differ in opinion. Anything else is simply someone not spending 5 seconds thinking geopolitics and logic through. The point of a spy agency is to spy. Don't pretend to be outraged when they do their damn jobs.

bigbugbag 10y ago
I may have badly expressed myself, my point was you can't counter argue about US external spying by saying "but other countries are much into internal spying". This make no sense on a logical basis. To me as a living being on this planet I strongly think no intelligence agency should exist at all for the simple reason that borders and countries should be abolished so we could all be earthlings sharing a planet. Buuuuut it seems the ones in position of domination such as US and old colonial Europe tend to disagree with this view. But this personal view does not prevent me from using my brains and senses to observe and having a certain understanding of how a minority of humans in position of power defend their own interest and push their own agenda and try to get every edge they can by whatever mean is available. The point of a spy agency is not to spy, it is to spy and not get caught, because when caught now it's a whole different game. So given the accumulation of recent leaks I would say that NSA and CIA do not so such a good job. And given the nature of the revelations and what is exposed it seems they go too far past what is acceptable. Compared to how China or Russia hack into the US without getting caught or exposed with a fraction of the US budget this paints a picture of an overspending of budget for arguably poor results for those agencies that not only get exposed but also fail at their mission of protection.
TheSpiceIsLife 10y ago
How do you reconcile the ideas that in an internet connected age where (1)people on HN often champion the idea that bits should be free to cross boarders unimpeded (eg. movies / songs / articles / messages / what-have-you should be available globally through your-favourite-streaming-chanenl) and that (2)there should be a difference between internal and external spying.

by phil21 10y ago

bigbugbag 10y ago

I may have badly expressed myself, my point was you can't counter argue about US external spying by saying "but other countries are much into internal spying". This make no sense on a logical basis. To me as a living being on this planet I strongly think no intelligence agency should exist at all for the simple reason that borders and countries should be abolished so we could all be earthlings sharing a planet. Buuuuut it seems the ones in position of domination such as US and old colonial Europe tend to disagree with this view. But this personal view does not prevent me from using my brains and senses to observe and having a certain understanding of how a minority of humans in position of power defend their own interest and push their own agenda and try to get every edge they can by whatever mean is available. The point of a spy agency is not to spy, it is to spy and not get caught, because when caught now it's a whole different game. So given the accumulation of recent leaks I would say that NSA and CIA do not so such a good job. And given the nature of the revelations and what is exposed it seems they go too far past what is acceptable. Compared to how China or Russia hack into the US without getting caught or exposed with a fraction of the US budget this paints a picture of an overspending of budget for arguably poor results for those agencies that not only get exposed but also fail at their mission of protection.

TheSpiceIsLife 10y ago

How do you reconcile the ideas that in an internet connected age where (1)people on HN often champion the idea that bits should be free to cross boarders unimpeded (eg. movies / songs / articles / messages / what-have-you should be available globally through your-favourite-streaming-chanenl) and that (2)there should be a difference between internal and external spying.