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While stealing the employee stock options is beyond pale, the real issue is what the working environment must be like there. I was in a similar situation many

While stealing the employee stock options is beyond pale, the real issue is what the working environment must be like there. I was in a similar situation many years ago with a completely corrupt management team. My boss and I got off on the wrong foot when he asked me to lie about another employee he wanted to fire and I refused (which led to him then trying to find people to dish dirt on me so he could fire me). The CEO and president were fully aware this kind of stuff was going on but looked the other way because he was producing the results they wanted to see (they weren't exactly clean either and several years later were both indicted on criminal charges). I saw multiple people break down in tears due to the pressure he put on them. Everyone was stressed out all the time. People were constantly in poor health due to the stress. Backstabbing was normal operating procedure just to stay off the hit list. People would doing anything to suck up to the boss so they could keep their job another week, or month, or quarter hoping things would get better. After I left the company I couldn't believe I put up with that. My health was in the toilet. Mentally I was wasted. I remember at my next job constantly worrying that everyone who was being nice to me was setting me up. I parsed every word people said to me looking for a trap. It took me a full year before I could sleep more than four hours a night. The ones who have left or were let go are the lucky ones. The stock can't be worth the physical and emotional damage. I've worked in a lot of high pressure jobs before that one and since then but that place will always stand out as the most damaging period in my life.

Balgair 9y ago
Now, I read these accounts and I wonder, if this is how businesses are run, even a small fraction of them, how are they in business at all? Like, it seems 'business' is really forgiving in terms of staying alive, like turning a profit must be really easy if these morons can do it and stay afloat for any length of time. But you go on /r/entrepreneur or some threads on HN and it is made out to be just a real drag and really really hard to do. What am I missing here, why the disconnect?
- droopyEyelids 9y ago
  You've built some sort of just-world hypothesis in your head, where kindness and 'goodness-as-a-person' relates to business success. In recorded human history, exploitative actors have often been successful in business. I know you've heard about slavery before.
- papabrown 9y ago
  I think you might be looking at it from the wrong angle. Some of the most morally bankrupt people I've ever met are crazy intelligent. You seem to equate being a sociopath with being a moron and that is more often than not a poor assumption. The other aspect that I think you're overlooking is that people who are wired like this are often incredibly driven people. Sure, someone on /r/entrepreneur might be willing to give up everything to pursue their dream but a sociopath is willing to lie, cheat, and steal to get what they want.
  - Balgair 9y ago
    Oh no, I agree, being an asshole and being smart are independent variables, it's a roll of the genetic dice. I meant: how are these folks who are both stupid and an asshole still kicking around?

Balgair 9y ago

Now, I read these accounts and I wonder, if this is how businesses are run, even a small fraction of them, how are they in business at all? Like, it seems 'business' is really forgiving in terms of staying alive, like turning a profit must be really easy if these morons can do it and stay afloat for any length of time. But you go on /r/entrepreneur or some threads on HN and it is made out to be just a real drag and really really hard to do. What am I missing here, why the disconnect?

droopyEyelids 9y ago
You've built some sort of just-world hypothesis in your head, where kindness and 'goodness-as-a-person' relates to business success. In recorded human history, exploitative actors have often been successful in business. I know you've heard about slavery before.
papabrown 9y ago
I think you might be looking at it from the wrong angle. Some of the most morally bankrupt people I've ever met are crazy intelligent. You seem to equate being a sociopath with being a moron and that is more often than not a poor assumption. The other aspect that I think you're overlooking is that people who are wired like this are often incredibly driven people. Sure, someone on /r/entrepreneur might be willing to give up everything to pursue their dream but a sociopath is willing to lie, cheat, and steal to get what they want.
- Balgair 9y ago
  Oh no, I agree, being an asshole and being smart are independent variables, it's a roll of the genetic dice. I meant: how are these folks who are both stupid and an asshole still kicking around?