7 ms·

I've been making apps on it since mid last year. It's an amazing device, the image stability and quality is very good and in a well-designed app the small FOV

I've been making apps on it since mid last year. It's an amazing device, the image stability and quality is very good and in a well-designed app the small FOV becomes an afterthought. Clicking/selecting objects with gaze is often an antipattern. Much better to use alternate input. Analytics is kind of a mess. Everybody recommends unity but performance will suffer. I wrote my own framework instead. Most of the open-source code is bad, if you have figured out how to make apps it's a competitive advantage. MS wrote literally thousands of new APIs for UWP and mixed reality so many many features are barely documented with no real world examples. It's a totally new paradigm in UX. Most designers fall back to poor decisions like using small buttons or overly detailed models. Feel free to ask anything specific I'll do my best to answer.

thecolorblue 10y ago
What is your development setup like? Do you have the hololens on while you are developing for it? Does the hololens do all the things a desktop computer can do, but in AR?
- doublerebel 10y ago
  Win 10 Pro, I was using an Ultrabook but just upgraded to a Surface Pro i7 16GB. The strength of machine depends on how complex your 3D models and build chain are, and whether you're running the emulator. The emulator needs 8GB RAM and two cores to itself. Visual Studio community edition with the occasional Sublime Text for quick refactors. I have the hololens on about half the time. So I've spent a ton of time in it. Yes surprisingly the Hololens is "just" an x86 Windows compile target. I've found a lot of software that "just works" as long as the UI isn't hardcoded.
wu-ikkyu 10y ago
What do you think this new paradigm in UX will look like?
- doublerebel 10y ago
  Subtle. Flat design, typography heavy. Outlines and hints over occlusion and forced actions. I also see a class separation between people who are augmented and who are not. It's going to blow apart industries and relationships. Eventually.
monk_e_boy 10y ago
Is AR the future? I demo'd google cardboard VR to a bunch of kids (prob about 200 ish) who thought it was amazing. They really enjoyed it and the feel from teaching them using VR was that this was another tool people will use in the future. Kids are already wired up with headphones, phones in pockets, phones wired to external battery boosters. I say this because I thought cumbersome cables from phone to goggles would be a no no and the technology would have to wait for a wireless solution. But I think I am wrong, kids already have cables snaking around their bodies. Personally I think external cameras that can show 'the outside world' inside the VR world is the future. I'm interested in your thoughts on AR... this I see as a great tool for industry, but not for the general public?
- doublerebel 10y ago
  I've believed it's the future since long before I had a hololens, so I am biased. But to me AR is far more than glasses, AR should be a natural extension of human function for all senses. People really don't like the concept that I can see a world they can't experience. Some people become offended. Making people feel comfortable has a long way to go, but as you mention kids start with no preconceived notions so this may not be a stigma for future generations.
  - NotQuantum 10y ago
    > People really don't like the concept that I can see a world they can't experience. Some people become offended This is the /exact/ kind of elitism that killed Google Glass. The whole "I have this and you don't" mentality is childish and damaging.
    - doublerebel 10y ago
      It's not the attitude of the wearer, I and other devs I've met really enjoy sharing it with everyone and wish it was more accessible. But I don't have a case full of hololenses to create a shared experience. Nevertheless in a group if one or two people are nerding out sometimes somebody finds it unpleasant. I can understand.
rmccoy6435 10y ago
Any chance you could expand on analytics a bit? Also, I've looked through the MVA for the HoloLens and done some messing around in Unity, but are there any good, active blogs about the HoloLens? I know there are a few like Mike Taulty and some other blogs that might post about it occasionally, but I would like a "Morning Dew" for HoloLens.
- doublerebel 10y ago
  Think about trying to track a funnel or "happy path" in AR and understanding intent from user's gaze and motion. There is no "go-to" analytics pattern or framework that I'm aware of yet. The AR blogs I find are mostly content-free, not exactly their fault because most demos are just PR demos and the real dev is under wraps at private industry. Similar to the comments here, whoever knows what's up is not talking. Lots of NDAs and patents around the technology.
  - rmccoy6435 10y ago
    That makes sense. I think that's a hard realm to develop a framework for, because I feel like you can only predict so much for so many people, much like regular programming, and a lot of it would be catered specifically to what your program does. As for blogs that's kind of what I've found. I've really been itching to get my hands on one and fiddle around with it. I see this as a technology that will only get bigger, and I want to get in on it early and develop a strong knowledge of how it works, and building applications for it properly, and the emulator can really only replicate so much of the true look and feel. I guess for now I'll just have to imagine what it's like with my Vive on...
    - newera2016 10y ago
      Would you mind sharing the blog that you have found?
      - rmccoy6435 10y ago
        Mike Taulty [0] has been posting ~2 posts per month on creating applications for the HoloLens (he just published his 13th yesterday) - he's a UK Microsoft Developer. There are a few other smaller blogs that occasionally post stuff like Abhijit's Blog (inactive) [1] and El Bruno [2]. Althought not a blog, the HoloLens subreddit sometimes has some interesting posts, but a lot of the time it's just articles about AR or videos of people showing off a demo (and not code or explanations per se) [3]. Lastly I recommend looking at the WindowsAppDev Daily Digest, as sometimes stuff is posted there regarding the HoloLens, or tangentially related topics [4]. [0] https://mtaulty.com/?s=Hitchhiking https://mtaulty.com/?s=Hitchhiking [1] https://abhijitjana.net/category/hololens/ https://abhijitjana.net/category/hololens/ [2] https://elbruno.com/category/hololens/ https://elbruno.com/category/hololens/ [3] https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloLens/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloLens/ [4] http://windowsappdev.com/ http://windowsappdev.com/
newera2016 10y ago
Hey"doublerebel", I am interested in learning more about Analytics/monitoring that you did. Would you be able to share more info? Please let me know how we can sync up so that I could learn more about it?
oceankid 10y ago
Thanks! What resources do you recommend for app UI designers to get their hands dirty with this 3D interface paradigm?
- doublerebel 10y ago
  You have to use the device. Often. To try to accomplish something real and useful. Then the limitations present themselves quickly. As far as a design workflow I've heard many designers are happy with their existing 3D tools like Maya and Unity. Any standard 3D object and texture can be loaded into the hololens.

thecolorblue 10y ago

What is your development setup like? Do you have the hololens on while you are developing for it? Does the hololens do all the things a desktop computer can do, but in AR?

doublerebel 10y ago
Win 10 Pro, I was using an Ultrabook but just upgraded to a Surface Pro i7 16GB. The strength of machine depends on how complex your 3D models and build chain are, and whether you're running the emulator. The emulator needs 8GB RAM and two cores to itself. Visual Studio community edition with the occasional Sublime Text for quick refactors. I have the hololens on about half the time. So I've spent a ton of time in it. Yes surprisingly the Hololens is "just" an x86 Windows compile target. I've found a lot of software that "just works" as long as the UI isn't hardcoded.

wu-ikkyu 10y ago

What do you think this new paradigm in UX will look like?

doublerebel 10y ago
Subtle. Flat design, typography heavy. Outlines and hints over occlusion and forced actions. I also see a class separation between people who are augmented and who are not. It's going to blow apart industries and relationships. Eventually.

monk_e_boy 10y ago

Is AR the future? I demo'd google cardboard VR to a bunch of kids (prob about 200 ish) who thought it was amazing. They really enjoyed it and the feel from teaching them using VR was that this was another tool people will use in the future. Kids are already wired up with headphones, phones in pockets, phones wired to external battery boosters. I say this because I thought cumbersome cables from phone to goggles would be a no no and the technology would have to wait for a wireless solution. But I think I am wrong, kids already have cables snaking around their bodies. Personally I think external cameras that can show 'the outside world' inside the VR world is the future. I'm interested in your thoughts on AR... this I see as a great tool for industry, but not for the general public?

doublerebel 10y ago
I've believed it's the future since long before I had a hololens, so I am biased. But to me AR is far more than glasses, AR should be a natural extension of human function for all senses. People really don't like the concept that I can see a world they can't experience. Some people become offended. Making people feel comfortable has a long way to go, but as you mention kids start with no preconceived notions so this may not be a stigma for future generations.
- NotQuantum 10y ago
  > People really don't like the concept that I can see a world they can't experience. Some people become offended This is the /exact/ kind of elitism that killed Google Glass. The whole "I have this and you don't" mentality is childish and damaging.
  - doublerebel 10y ago
    It's not the attitude of the wearer, I and other devs I've met really enjoy sharing it with everyone and wish it was more accessible. But I don't have a case full of hololenses to create a shared experience. Nevertheless in a group if one or two people are nerding out sometimes somebody finds it unpleasant. I can understand.

rmccoy6435 10y ago

Any chance you could expand on analytics a bit? Also, I've looked through the MVA for the HoloLens and done some messing around in Unity, but are there any good, active blogs about the HoloLens? I know there are a few like Mike Taulty and some other blogs that might post about it occasionally, but I would like a "Morning Dew" for HoloLens.

doublerebel 10y ago
Think about trying to track a funnel or "happy path" in AR and understanding intent from user's gaze and motion. There is no "go-to" analytics pattern or framework that I'm aware of yet. The AR blogs I find are mostly content-free, not exactly their fault because most demos are just PR demos and the real dev is under wraps at private industry. Similar to the comments here, whoever knows what's up is not talking. Lots of NDAs and patents around the technology.
- rmccoy6435 10y ago
  That makes sense. I think that's a hard realm to develop a framework for, because I feel like you can only predict so much for so many people, much like regular programming, and a lot of it would be catered specifically to what your program does. As for blogs that's kind of what I've found. I've really been itching to get my hands on one and fiddle around with it. I see this as a technology that will only get bigger, and I want to get in on it early and develop a strong knowledge of how it works, and building applications for it properly, and the emulator can really only replicate so much of the true look and feel. I guess for now I'll just have to imagine what it's like with my Vive on...
  - newera2016 10y ago
    Would you mind sharing the blog that you have found?
    - rmccoy6435 10y ago
      Mike Taulty [0] has been posting ~2 posts per month on creating applications for the HoloLens (he just published his 13th yesterday) - he's a UK Microsoft Developer. There are a few other smaller blogs that occasionally post stuff like Abhijit's Blog (inactive) [1] and El Bruno [2]. Althought not a blog, the HoloLens subreddit sometimes has some interesting posts, but a lot of the time it's just articles about AR or videos of people showing off a demo (and not code or explanations per se) [3]. Lastly I recommend looking at the WindowsAppDev Daily Digest, as sometimes stuff is posted there regarding the HoloLens, or tangentially related topics [4]. [0] https://mtaulty.com/?s=Hitchhiking https://mtaulty.com/?s=Hitchhiking [1] https://abhijitjana.net/category/hololens/ https://abhijitjana.net/category/hololens/ [2] https://elbruno.com/category/hololens/ https://elbruno.com/category/hololens/ [3] https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloLens/ https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloLens/ [4] http://windowsappdev.com/ http://windowsappdev.com/

newera2016 10y ago

Hey"doublerebel", I am interested in learning more about Analytics/monitoring that you did. Would you be able to share more info? Please let me know how we can sync up so that I could learn more about it?

oceankid 10y ago

Thanks! What resources do you recommend for app UI designers to get their hands dirty with this 3D interface paradigm?

doublerebel 10y ago
You have to use the device. Often. To try to accomplish something real and useful. Then the limitations present themselves quickly. As far as a design workflow I've heard many designers are happy with their existing 3D tools like Maya and Unity. Any standard 3D object and texture can be loaded into the hololens.