3 ms·

>How can you argue that the right is against the concentration of power when it works to limit voting systematically among people more likely to vote democratic

by gozur88 10y ago

>How can you argue that the right is against the concentration of power when it works to limit voting systematically among people more likely to vote democratic (young people, poor people, counties where people who aren't white are a majority)... Because you've mischaracterized the situation. Making sure only people who are entitled to vote actually vote is about insuring the integrity of the system. >...as well as to gerrymander districts? This happens on both sides of the aisle. To pretend only "the right" is doing it is to be oblivious to observed reality.

eschaton 10y ago
Actually, things like voter ID requirements and DMV closings are specifically about putting up barriers to voting for people who do have the right to vote, by making it (in some cases) much harder to meet the requirements to exercise their franchise. You can't look at policies and their arguments in isolation, you have to look at them in context. In context their purpose is clear.
- gozur88 10y ago
  >Actually, things like voter ID requirements and DMV closings are specifically about putting up barriers to voting for people who do have the right to vote, by making it (in some cases) much harder to meet the requirements to exercise their franchise. No they aren't. This is nonsense from people who are benefiting from voter fraud.
  - chillwaves 10y ago
    > people who are benefiting from voter fraud. Where is the evidence that this occurs in any meaningful number at all? If you want to claim someone is benefiting, then you must have some evidence that it even occurs.
    - gozur88 10y ago
      Since we're demanding evidence, do you have any evidence Republicans are deliberately trying to suppress voters?
      - pjc50 10y ago
        It's all there in the litigation if you care to look. You could start at e.g. https://www.propublica.org/article/2016-election-lawsuit-tracker-new-election-laws-suits-challenging-them https://www.propublica.org/article/2016-election-lawsuit-tra... and get to e.g. http://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000156-3775-d2b4-a3d7-b7fdaa6a0001 http://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000156-3775-d2b4-a3d7-b7fdaa... "After years of preclearance and expansion of voting access, by 2013 African American registration and turnout rates had finally reached near-parity with white registration and turnout rates. African Americans were poised to act as a major electoral force. But, on the day after the Supreme Court issued Shelby County v. Holder, 133 S. Ct. 2612 (2013), eliminating preclearance obligations, a leader of the party that newly dominated the legislature (and the party that rarely enjoyed African American support) announced an intention to enact what he characterized as an “omnibus” election law. Before enacting that law, the legislature requested data on the use, by race, of a number of voting practices. Upon receipt of the race data , the General Assembly enacted legislation that restricted voting and registration in five different ways, all of which disproportionately affected African Americans. In response to claims that intentional racial discrimination animated its action, the State offered only meager justifications. Although the new provisions target African Americans with almost surgical precision, they constitute inapt remedies for the problems assertedly justifying them and, in fact, impose cures for problems that did not exist. "
        gozur88 10y ago
        That's not what I asked. I asked for evidence Republicans were deliberately trying to suppress voters.
        chillwaves 10y ago
  - LeeHwang 10y ago
    Yea Voter ID is adopted across the world. It's a nonsensical argument it is meant to disenfranchise people in 2017. Example of Countries with voter id laws: India ,Libya,Ireland, Spain, Greece, France, Malta, Belgium, and Italy
    - chillwaves 10y ago
      People are against a national ID not voter IDs (which essentially requires a federal/national ID to preserve access). I personally have no problem with a national ID. It seems most opposition comes from the same camp that claims rampant voter fraud is a serious problem.
- Dunan 10y ago
  Automobile-related bureaucracy should have no place at all in anything related to voting. Why should a disabled person who can never make use of the DMV's real purpose have to go there just to exercise a Constitutional right? If people want voter ID, have them issued by City Hall, or print the voter's name on the sample ballot mailed to the voter's home before the election and have them bring that to the polling place.

by gozur88 10y ago

eschaton 10y ago

Actually, things like voter ID requirements and DMV closings are specifically about putting up barriers to voting for people who do have the right to vote, by making it (in some cases) much harder to meet the requirements to exercise their franchise. You can't look at policies and their arguments in isolation, you have to look at them in context. In context their purpose is clear.

gozur88 10y ago
>Actually, things like voter ID requirements and DMV closings are specifically about putting up barriers to voting for people who do have the right to vote, by making it (in some cases) much harder to meet the requirements to exercise their franchise. No they aren't. This is nonsense from people who are benefiting from voter fraud.
- chillwaves 10y ago
  > people who are benefiting from voter fraud. Where is the evidence that this occurs in any meaningful number at all? If you want to claim someone is benefiting, then you must have some evidence that it even occurs.
  - gozur88 10y ago
    Since we're demanding evidence, do you have any evidence Republicans are deliberately trying to suppress voters?
    - pjc50 10y ago
      It's all there in the litigation if you care to look. You could start at e.g. https://www.propublica.org/article/2016-election-lawsuit-tracker-new-election-laws-suits-challenging-them https://www.propublica.org/article/2016-election-lawsuit-tra... and get to e.g. http://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000156-3775-d2b4-a3d7-b7fdaa6a0001 http://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000156-3775-d2b4-a3d7-b7fdaa... "After years of preclearance and expansion of voting access, by 2013 African American registration and turnout rates had finally reached near-parity with white registration and turnout rates. African Americans were poised to act as a major electoral force. But, on the day after the Supreme Court issued Shelby County v. Holder, 133 S. Ct. 2612 (2013), eliminating preclearance obligations, a leader of the party that newly dominated the legislature (and the party that rarely enjoyed African American support) announced an intention to enact what he characterized as an “omnibus” election law. Before enacting that law, the legislature requested data on the use, by race, of a number of voting practices. Upon receipt of the race data , the General Assembly enacted legislation that restricted voting and registration in five different ways, all of which disproportionately affected African Americans. In response to claims that intentional racial discrimination animated its action, the State offered only meager justifications. Although the new provisions target African Americans with almost surgical precision, they constitute inapt remedies for the problems assertedly justifying them and, in fact, impose cures for problems that did not exist. "
      - gozur88 10y ago
        That's not what I asked. I asked for evidence Republicans were deliberately trying to suppress voters.
        chillwaves 10y ago
- LeeHwang 10y ago
  Yea Voter ID is adopted across the world. It's a nonsensical argument it is meant to disenfranchise people in 2017. Example of Countries with voter id laws: India ,Libya,Ireland, Spain, Greece, France, Malta, Belgium, and Italy
  - chillwaves 10y ago
    People are against a national ID not voter IDs (which essentially requires a federal/national ID to preserve access). I personally have no problem with a national ID. It seems most opposition comes from the same camp that claims rampant voter fraud is a serious problem.
Dunan 10y ago
Automobile-related bureaucracy should have no place at all in anything related to voting. Why should a disabled person who can never make use of the DMV's real purpose have to go there just to exercise a Constitutional right? If people want voter ID, have them issued by City Hall, or print the voter's name on the sample ballot mailed to the voter's home before the election and have them bring that to the polling place.