5 ms·

Sounds like it wasn't the normal overbooking procedure - it was overfull because of united employees.

by problems 9y ago

lamby 9y ago
Perhaps, but why let too many people past the final boarding gate check?
- jessaustin 9y ago
  The plane was full before all the United employees showed up? Yeah they should have gotten there sooner, but in previous situations when I knew the plane would wait on me I've been the last to board...
  - mintplant 9y ago
    I don't think that answers lamby's question. Surely they know how many of their own employees will be flying ahead of time?
    - jessaustin 9y ago
      Do uniformed airline employees get tickets? I've seen them board without producing tickets. They don't have to wait in line either. United might just have decided that it's easier to trust the discretion of its employees than to figure out ahead of time who's going where, when, especially since that could change constantly based on numerous factors.
      - tyingq 9y ago
        There's a structured system and documents for any employee flying. They have a variety of statuses ranging from "space available" to "must ride".
    - tyingq 9y ago
      >Surely they know how many of their own employees will be flying ahead of time? They don't always. Crews call in sick, flights get cancelled, weather changes schedules, incoming flight being late delays connecting flight, etc. One aircraft type gets swapped for another (not all crews are qualified on all aircraft). Last minute crew moves will always exist. It's also not 100% clear that these employees were essential crew, or that they couldn't have taken a different flight. There's usually a range of employees flying, not all classed as "must ride", and often some that shouldn't be classified as "must ride". Of course, how you choose to open up seats is up to you.
  - gdilla 9y ago
    they're not allowed to take off unless every passenger with a checked bag is on board. That's the law. Often they end up removing the bags and taking off without them.
ww520 9y ago
United employees taking passenger's seats? That's not overbooked. That's robbery.
- oh_sigh 9y ago
  No, it's robbery if United doesn't compensate you for denying your boarding.
- rhino369 9y ago
  Not like united employees going on vacation or to a meeting. But a flight crew going to where they need to be. It's part and parcel of an airline service. If they can't get to where they need to be a flight will have to be delayed or canceled.
  - djsumdog 9y ago
    It comes down to the balance I guess. We can kick four people off and offer them each shitty compensation (usually a first class ticket for the next flight and worthless $200 vouchers for the same shitty airline that expire in less than 6 months) or cancel the flight this crew is for and lose an entire plane load worth of income. I understand the economics, but it's still bullshit. Those customers want to get home and they're boarded. I think everyone should do what this guy did in this situation. He paid for a flight. He didn't read through the 10 pages of bullshit EULA (no one does) and then they assaulted him to remove him from a flight. The whole plane looked angry. Now United has a PR nightmare .. that will last 3 days before everyone forgets. People keep flying United and nothing really happens.
    - problems 9y ago
      You have to understand why they overbook - jetfuel is extremely expensive and produces a massive amount of carbon pollution - most of the airlines barely operate at margin as it is. Cargo is cheaper to fly than passengers and many of them are converting more and more towards cargo for that reason. You don't want to be flying around in jets which aren't at capacity, it's an enormous waste of money and fuel - your tickets would cost significantly more and they'd have to run more flights resulting in more pollution. Their estimates are pretty good even - your odds of being overbooked - even on United, one of the worst offenders here - are about 1/1000. From what I've heard, you can sort of bargain with them from what I've heard, free food and drink, hotel accommodations, a partial refund even are commonly obtainable if you get delayed - though that kind of thing may depend on the airline. According to https://lifehacker.com/if-your-flight-is-overbooked-dont-volunteer-to-get-bum-1722036179 https://lifehacker.com/if-your-flight-is-overbooked-dont-vol... you can actually get 2-4x the ticket price if you deny getting bumped. I'd take that kind of cash in many situations. This was severely mishandled - the big mistake here was boarding the passengers before knowing the final count with the employees. It caused them not be able to bargain with individual customers to find someone who was willing to give up their seat for some perks or cash.
mnm1 9y ago
Then they should have figured that out before boarding everyone. This is a colossal fuckup. The airline assaulted its own customers beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher. And yet people still defend them.
- passivepinetree 9y ago
  Obviously United was in the wrong here, but you might be going a little far. The main purpose of the stretcher might have been for restraining the man. It's wise to avoid making such inflammatory statements until we know more.
  - mnm1 9y ago
    Whether he was beaten to the point he couldn't walk or restrained on a stretcher doesn't substantially change the colossal fuckup that is this situation nor the fact that they assaulted at least one passenger.
    - passivepinetree 9y ago
      I totally agree with you, but the parent said "The airline assaulted its own customers beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher" when a) the police department assaulted the customer, not United staff (although they did call the PD in the first place) b) "beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher" obviously implies he was beaten until he couldn't walk, which is an allegation that hasn't been substantiated at this point. I totally agree that United colossally fucked up here, but the statement the parent made that I quoted earlier is patently false. I'm all for being righteously outraged, but can we please stick to factual statements while we're doing it?
  - Doxin 9y ago
    The main purpose of the stretcher was most definitely because the man was severely injured. Go hang around people with a confused mental state for a while and you'll recognise the behaviour the man shows when het gets back on the plane. He isn't just being a stubborn ass there.

Sounds like it wasn't the normal overbooking procedure - it was overfull because of united employees.

lamby 9y ago

Perhaps, but why let too many people past the final boarding gate check?

jessaustin 9y ago
The plane was full before all the United employees showed up? Yeah they should have gotten there sooner, but in previous situations when I knew the plane would wait on me I've been the last to board...
- mintplant 9y ago
  I don't think that answers lamby's question. Surely they know how many of their own employees will be flying ahead of time?
  - jessaustin 9y ago
    Do uniformed airline employees get tickets? I've seen them board without producing tickets. They don't have to wait in line either. United might just have decided that it's easier to trust the discretion of its employees than to figure out ahead of time who's going where, when, especially since that could change constantly based on numerous factors.
    - tyingq 9y ago
      There's a structured system and documents for any employee flying. They have a variety of statuses ranging from "space available" to "must ride".
  - tyingq 9y ago
    >Surely they know how many of their own employees will be flying ahead of time? They don't always. Crews call in sick, flights get cancelled, weather changes schedules, incoming flight being late delays connecting flight, etc. One aircraft type gets swapped for another (not all crews are qualified on all aircraft). Last minute crew moves will always exist. It's also not 100% clear that these employees were essential crew, or that they couldn't have taken a different flight. There's usually a range of employees flying, not all classed as "must ride", and often some that shouldn't be classified as "must ride". Of course, how you choose to open up seats is up to you.
- gdilla 9y ago
  they're not allowed to take off unless every passenger with a checked bag is on board. That's the law. Often they end up removing the bags and taking off without them.

ww520 9y ago

United employees taking passenger's seats? That's not overbooked. That's robbery.

oh_sigh 9y ago
No, it's robbery if United doesn't compensate you for denying your boarding.
rhino369 9y ago
Not like united employees going on vacation or to a meeting. But a flight crew going to where they need to be. It's part and parcel of an airline service. If they can't get to where they need to be a flight will have to be delayed or canceled.
- djsumdog 9y ago
  It comes down to the balance I guess. We can kick four people off and offer them each shitty compensation (usually a first class ticket for the next flight and worthless $200 vouchers for the same shitty airline that expire in less than 6 months) or cancel the flight this crew is for and lose an entire plane load worth of income. I understand the economics, but it's still bullshit. Those customers want to get home and they're boarded. I think everyone should do what this guy did in this situation. He paid for a flight. He didn't read through the 10 pages of bullshit EULA (no one does) and then they assaulted him to remove him from a flight. The whole plane looked angry. Now United has a PR nightmare .. that will last 3 days before everyone forgets. People keep flying United and nothing really happens.
  - problems 9y ago
    You have to understand why they overbook - jetfuel is extremely expensive and produces a massive amount of carbon pollution - most of the airlines barely operate at margin as it is. Cargo is cheaper to fly than passengers and many of them are converting more and more towards cargo for that reason. You don't want to be flying around in jets which aren't at capacity, it's an enormous waste of money and fuel - your tickets would cost significantly more and they'd have to run more flights resulting in more pollution. Their estimates are pretty good even - your odds of being overbooked - even on United, one of the worst offenders here - are about 1/1000. From what I've heard, you can sort of bargain with them from what I've heard, free food and drink, hotel accommodations, a partial refund even are commonly obtainable if you get delayed - though that kind of thing may depend on the airline. According to https://lifehacker.com/if-your-flight-is-overbooked-dont-volunteer-to-get-bum-1722036179 https://lifehacker.com/if-your-flight-is-overbooked-dont-vol... you can actually get 2-4x the ticket price if you deny getting bumped. I'd take that kind of cash in many situations. This was severely mishandled - the big mistake here was boarding the passengers before knowing the final count with the employees. It caused them not be able to bargain with individual customers to find someone who was willing to give up their seat for some perks or cash.

mnm1 9y ago

Then they should have figured that out before boarding everyone. This is a colossal fuckup. The airline assaulted its own customers beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher. And yet people still defend them.

passivepinetree 9y ago
Obviously United was in the wrong here, but you might be going a little far. The main purpose of the stretcher might have been for restraining the man. It's wise to avoid making such inflammatory statements until we know more.
- mnm1 9y ago
  Whether he was beaten to the point he couldn't walk or restrained on a stretcher doesn't substantially change the colossal fuckup that is this situation nor the fact that they assaulted at least one passenger.
  - passivepinetree 9y ago
    I totally agree with you, but the parent said "The airline assaulted its own customers beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher" when a) the police department assaulted the customer, not United staff (although they did call the PD in the first place) b) "beating them till they had to be carried out on a stretcher" obviously implies he was beaten until he couldn't walk, which is an allegation that hasn't been substantiated at this point. I totally agree that United colossally fucked up here, but the statement the parent made that I quoted earlier is patently false. I'm all for being righteously outraged, but can we please stick to factual statements while we're doing it?
- Doxin 9y ago
  The main purpose of the stretcher was most definitely because the man was severely injured. Go hang around people with a confused mental state for a while and you'll recognise the behaviour the man shows when het gets back on the plane. He isn't just being a stubborn ass there.