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I can see how IoT is extremely useful in industrial and infrastructure applications (e.g. monitoring leaks in pipes). I can see how if I was a retail store I'd

I can see how IoT is extremely useful in industrial and infrastructure applications (e.g. monitoring leaks in pipes). I can see how if I was a retail store I'd wanted to track everyone moving through my shops. But ... are there any compelling consumer applications? Lights that change color don't count. Connected thermostats---I've never understood the appeal.

ktta 10y ago
I think that's because, we tend to have a strict opinion of what IoT is. And that's apparent in industrial use, where it just collects data to relay it so that other people can make use of it. But the IoT in our homes are much more subtle. People don't just buy standalone temperature sensors. If you see carefully, the IoT wave we're expecting is coming in slowly, bundled with other things. These days most of the appliances which were dumb before, like fridges, coffee makers, security cameras, smoke detectors, washing machines, cleaners (roomba, etc.) and others are now connecting to the internet. I mean, a washing machine connecting to the internet might seem preposterous so some now, but I don't think that'll be the case when they get better. Along with Alexa, Google Home, the digital assistants that are yet to come have a chance to really change the way people use their devices at home. If they get it right, and not close off communication to their own servers (Which, I sadly see is happening now and doesn't seem like it'll go away) I think there's a real chance they might have a big market.
- bshimmin 10y ago
  But what is the actual benefit to the consumer? What is the user story here? "I want my washing machine connected to the Internet so that _________"? I can't finish this sentence - I have literally no idea. As another commenter suggested, I expect the incumbent giants will add the IoT functionality to most mid-range consumer products anyway, whether anyone wants them to or not, and then it will be proclaimed a great success, while the consumer will be left utterly in the dark about why their fridge has a wifi symbol on it or what it can be used for. Perhaps it'll be less like 3D printers and more like 3D TV, which has apparently now quietly died a death (I tried it once on my TV, because I work in tech and felt some sort of weird obligation to - I'm sure many people never even tried those stupid 3D glasses that came with their TV).
  - ktta 10y ago
    Automation/Notification 1. Your oven can cook the pizza in the oven, which will be ready by the time you are home. 2. Your coffee maker can check your location to see if you're in town or not and decide to make coffee. 3. Security cameras can upload video to cloud directly so you can see them from anywhere live. They can be motion activated to alert you so that you can check if it is a dog or a burglar. 4. A fridge which recently came out with a camera which you can check to see what you need to buy[1]. Can be triggered when your location is close to a grocery store. 5. Your smoke detector can send you a notification, turn off the internet connected thermostat and any other appliances. Can turn on the security camera inside so you can check if it's your family burning cookies or house burning down. 6. You washing machine can remind you when your load is done. Can send you reminders that you didn't do laundry for a while. 7. Roomba already does neat stuff that I don't need to explain here. As I said, the real benefit comes when they all work together. There are custom solutions, but if one can set up everything so that it can track your location/schedule to automate things, that would make for a great increase in quality of life. You won't keep forgetting food in the oven, let the heat bill run up too high, forget your clothes in the washer, and a nice coffee as soon as you wake up. This might seem insignificant, but I think it's similar to having a very smart housekeeper (although not as capable). Combined with all the data about you, like weight, heart rate, schedule, etc. intelligent systems can work pretty well. [1]: http://www.samsung.com/us/explore/family-hub-refrigerator/ http://www.samsung.com/us/explore/family-hub-refrigerator/
    - flukus 10y ago
      1. How does the pizza get to the oven? 2. Lot's of issues, my presence does not determine my need for coffee. 4. Sounds great but in reality you won't be able to see things hidden behind other things or if a sauce bottle is full or empty. 7. What does roomba do that I need apart from a timer? From your list is seems like we'll have an internet of half working things that everyone turns off after a week because they're more trouble than they're worth.
      - ktta 10y ago
        They aren't perfect. I don't really know what I was thinking with the first one, but I'll just rephrase it to remotely controllable oven. You can read more about what Roomba can do here[1]. If it isn't for you that's fine. Not everyone needs to buy sauces all the time. Usually just a look suffices. The problems you talk about aren't against IoT but just the use case I specify here. They're very solvable and there are many more uses than I can talk about. I'm not a salesman for these products so I just said what came to mind. When any new technology first comes to market and tries to blow everyone's minds away, it often fails to make the entrance it anticipates because, in your words, "they're more trouble than they're worth". But all they need is some rethinking and time. When PDAs first came out, my dad scoffed at them and used a large notebook to write down notes. But today that's changed. I think that'll be the same with IoT. We're increasingly moving towards a more electronic home, and that's not stopping anytime soon. It just needs some time to reach proper attention just like phones did, and we'll have standards (hopefully) which can harness the power of connected devices in your home. As the other commented to GPs reply said, a great factor is energy saving too. Intelligent devices can figure out by themselves when to turn on and off, and that can do a lot of power savings. [1]:https://store.irobot.com/default/robot-vacuum-roomba/ https://store.irobot.com/default/robot-vacuum-roomba/
andromeda__ 10y ago
> I can see how if I was a retail store I'd wanted to track everyone moving through my shops. Please elaborate on how this is possible i.e. what part of the tech would allow for this to happen. Plus why this tracking would be interesting to retailers or brands.
- noelwelsh 10y ago
  iBeacon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBeacon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBeacon) is one way to achieve this, but AFAIK it hasn't had much adoption. If I was doing this I'd probably first look at video tracking via existing CCTV cameras, possibly augmented with information like iBeacon. The book "Why We Buy" gives examples of how manipulating sight lines and visitor flow through stores can increase sales. If you could track visitor paths continuously you could continually optimise your store layout, rather than doing a one-off with outside consultants. Think of it as the offline equivalent of continuous A/B testing.

ktta 10y ago

I think that's because, we tend to have a strict opinion of what IoT is. And that's apparent in industrial use, where it just collects data to relay it so that other people can make use of it. But the IoT in our homes are much more subtle. People don't just buy standalone temperature sensors. If you see carefully, the IoT wave we're expecting is coming in slowly, bundled with other things. These days most of the appliances which were dumb before, like fridges, coffee makers, security cameras, smoke detectors, washing machines, cleaners (roomba, etc.) and others are now connecting to the internet. I mean, a washing machine connecting to the internet might seem preposterous so some now, but I don't think that'll be the case when they get better. Along with Alexa, Google Home, the digital assistants that are yet to come have a chance to really change the way people use their devices at home. If they get it right, and not close off communication to their own servers (Which, I sadly see is happening now and doesn't seem like it'll go away) I think there's a real chance they might have a big market.

bshimmin 10y ago
But what is the actual benefit to the consumer? What is the user story here? "I want my washing machine connected to the Internet so that _________"? I can't finish this sentence - I have literally no idea. As another commenter suggested, I expect the incumbent giants will add the IoT functionality to most mid-range consumer products anyway, whether anyone wants them to or not, and then it will be proclaimed a great success, while the consumer will be left utterly in the dark about why their fridge has a wifi symbol on it or what it can be used for. Perhaps it'll be less like 3D printers and more like 3D TV, which has apparently now quietly died a death (I tried it once on my TV, because I work in tech and felt some sort of weird obligation to - I'm sure many people never even tried those stupid 3D glasses that came with their TV).
- ktta 10y ago
  Automation/Notification 1. Your oven can cook the pizza in the oven, which will be ready by the time you are home. 2. Your coffee maker can check your location to see if you're in town or not and decide to make coffee. 3. Security cameras can upload video to cloud directly so you can see them from anywhere live. They can be motion activated to alert you so that you can check if it is a dog or a burglar. 4. A fridge which recently came out with a camera which you can check to see what you need to buy[1]. Can be triggered when your location is close to a grocery store. 5. Your smoke detector can send you a notification, turn off the internet connected thermostat and any other appliances. Can turn on the security camera inside so you can check if it's your family burning cookies or house burning down. 6. You washing machine can remind you when your load is done. Can send you reminders that you didn't do laundry for a while. 7. Roomba already does neat stuff that I don't need to explain here. As I said, the real benefit comes when they all work together. There are custom solutions, but if one can set up everything so that it can track your location/schedule to automate things, that would make for a great increase in quality of life. You won't keep forgetting food in the oven, let the heat bill run up too high, forget your clothes in the washer, and a nice coffee as soon as you wake up. This might seem insignificant, but I think it's similar to having a very smart housekeeper (although not as capable). Combined with all the data about you, like weight, heart rate, schedule, etc. intelligent systems can work pretty well. [1]: http://www.samsung.com/us/explore/family-hub-refrigerator/ http://www.samsung.com/us/explore/family-hub-refrigerator/
  - flukus 10y ago
    1. How does the pizza get to the oven? 2. Lot's of issues, my presence does not determine my need for coffee. 4. Sounds great but in reality you won't be able to see things hidden behind other things or if a sauce bottle is full or empty. 7. What does roomba do that I need apart from a timer? From your list is seems like we'll have an internet of half working things that everyone turns off after a week because they're more trouble than they're worth.
    - ktta 10y ago
      They aren't perfect. I don't really know what I was thinking with the first one, but I'll just rephrase it to remotely controllable oven. You can read more about what Roomba can do here[1]. If it isn't for you that's fine. Not everyone needs to buy sauces all the time. Usually just a look suffices. The problems you talk about aren't against IoT but just the use case I specify here. They're very solvable and there are many more uses than I can talk about. I'm not a salesman for these products so I just said what came to mind. When any new technology first comes to market and tries to blow everyone's minds away, it often fails to make the entrance it anticipates because, in your words, "they're more trouble than they're worth". But all they need is some rethinking and time. When PDAs first came out, my dad scoffed at them and used a large notebook to write down notes. But today that's changed. I think that'll be the same with IoT. We're increasingly moving towards a more electronic home, and that's not stopping anytime soon. It just needs some time to reach proper attention just like phones did, and we'll have standards (hopefully) which can harness the power of connected devices in your home. As the other commented to GPs reply said, a great factor is energy saving too. Intelligent devices can figure out by themselves when to turn on and off, and that can do a lot of power savings. [1]:https://store.irobot.com/default/robot-vacuum-roomba/ https://store.irobot.com/default/robot-vacuum-roomba/

andromeda__ 10y ago

> I can see how if I was a retail store I'd wanted to track everyone moving through my shops. Please elaborate on how this is possible i.e. what part of the tech would allow for this to happen. Plus why this tracking would be interesting to retailers or brands.

noelwelsh 10y ago
iBeacon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBeacon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBeacon) is one way to achieve this, but AFAIK it hasn't had much adoption. If I was doing this I'd probably first look at video tracking via existing CCTV cameras, possibly augmented with information like iBeacon. The book "Why We Buy" gives examples of how manipulating sight lines and visitor flow through stores can increase sales. If you could track visitor paths continuously you could continually optimise your store layout, rather than doing a one-off with outside consultants. Think of it as the offline equivalent of continuous A/B testing.