9 ms·

You of course are so open minded that you see no problem in cleaning up stranger's piles of used condoms, or having them strewn about your house. Just part of a

by anjc 10y ago

You of course are so open minded that you see no problem in cleaning up stranger's piles of used condoms, or having them strewn about your house. Just part of a regular day in dandare's world. Edit: Look at everybody pretending that cleaning up dozens of men's bodily ejections after they used your house as a brothel is just one of life's little chores. You've all spent too long on Reddit.

bingomad123 10y ago
Cleaning up reasonable trash is pretty much part of AirBnb host's job. So if a women throws her sanitary pads/tampoons in the trash will you call them names too ?
- camus2 10y ago
  What about the clients? do you really think it's a great environment for families? Once a place becomes a well known prostitution hub, it attracts a specific kind of people, and not the good ones.
  - 2muchcoffeeman 10y ago
    Sex work is legal/decriminalised in Sydney. If you come from a country where it is illegal, you might be surprised how open it is around here. And right next to family friendly establishments, residential areas. It's pretty safe actually. Or at least no more dangerous than other parts of Sydney. I've never heard of any crimes or violence related to sex workers in Sydney. I'm more worried about alcohol and drug related violence. If there are any unsavoury characters about they are much more likely to be at a night club. Ban night clubs (they kind of did that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_lockout_laws https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_lockout_laws and it worked).
  - ACow_Adonis 10y ago
    CEOs? Businessmen? Politicians? Founders? The physically disabled? Nervous silly college kids? Cheaters? Low lifes? I've got news for you, they might visit the brothels, but they live out in the burbs near you :P They live near all of us. Perhaps I'm just jaded/acclimatised from having worked in the suburb of Fyshwick in Canberra (where operating a brothel/in-home prostitution is quite common), knew there were prostitutes regularly working out of hotels/their own houses, and I'm pretty sure there's probably a couple of brothels around where I live. Honestly, I can't say I keep track of them...I can't say they're even on my mental radar... Don't misunderstand me, i know there are a significant number of people who wouldn't want to raise children in such an environment. But it doesn't bother me, nor the other families living here, and the general property prices around here suggest it doesn't sufficiently bother most of the people who live here :\ But I also knew prostitutes were working frequently out of suburban homes and hotels, so i'm a bit "you're not actually that far from prostitutes..." to all my suburban friends.
  - bingomad123 10y ago
    > it's a great environment for families And why would anyone care if it is great environment for families ? Are US suburbs great environment for families where Ms. X who has 4 kids all from different people living with her boyfriend ? Is that a good environment ?
- anjc 10y ago
  Maybe yeah. It would rightly depend on how correctly and securely she disposes of her waste. Why are you trying to finagle a woman's analogous example as if that'll shame me into changing my mind...these prostitutes were women.
kalleboo 10y ago
People who aren't prostitutes also have sex in hotels you know. Not cleaning up after themselves is a valid complaint but doesn't seem something specific to prostitutes.
- M_Grey 10y ago
  Higher rates of STD's however... I'm all for legalization, but if you run a brothel out of my place I'm going to be seriously pissed off and not just get all libertarian about it. I will after all, have rented under non-commercial grounds anyway; I'd be pissed if you ran a pop-up restaurant there too.
  - foldr 10y ago
    This STD argument is silly. You aren't going to get an STD from cleaning up used condoms.
    - M_Grey 10y ago
      Hep C is more than able to survive outside of the body (especially in a little pocket of nutrient-rich fluids) for quite some time (as in weeks). I grant you the odds of contracting it from even sexual contact, never mind casual contact with a condom is extremely low, but it's still a fucking biohazard you shouldn't have to deal with. The odds of being struck and killed by a bullet fired up into the air is vanishingly small too, but it's happened, and since it's unconscionable to randomly discharge your firearm into the air, it's unacceptable too. Needless to say, when you don't intend to rent your home out as a business, it's equally unacceptable if someone decides to use it as one. Edit: I... just realized how Freudian my analogy of "discharging firearms into the air" is. I really should get more sleep.
      - foldr 10y ago
        It's an insignificant risk. Virtually zero if you just use ordinary cleaning gloves. It surely can't be the risk of infection that is the issue here.
gambiting 10y ago
It's literally the bread and butter of working in a hotel. I don't see hotels complaining that their rooms are being used for sleeping with prostitutes or sex in general. I wouldn't expect guests of AirBnB to not do anything they would do in a hotel - after all you are attracting the same audience. Bottom line - if they left a mess, then call a cleaning company and charge the guests a cleaning fee. Pretty much every AirBnB has a cleaning fee in terms of rental. Would the reaction here be any different if an actual couple left the host with a pile of condoms? If yes,why? If no, why?
- anjc 10y ago
  Cleaning up after a prostitute's night of work is not the bread and butter of working in a hotel, and I'm sure that you would see staff and owners complaining about it if you talked to them.
  - vertex-four 10y ago
    Cleaning up rather horrible messes of things people would rather not touch is, in fact, normal, albeit not the norm (i.e. it happens on a regular enough basis that it's not anything special, but most rooms are relatively ok).
    - anjc 10y ago
      Oh yeah of course, but I'm sure hotel owners and staff don't just tut and laugh and go "the prostitutes again haha", and don't particularly enjoy cleaning up after people who've used your facilities to make a lot of money illegally. As in...they'd turn down the custom if they could.
      - vertex-four 10y ago
        Sure, but if you have facilities open to the public you're going to get... the public. It's hardly just prostitutes that leave rooms in a state, after all. It's something you plan for, and you don't get to whine about having failed to plan for it.
ACow_Adonis 10y ago
Regular AirBnB guests would never partake in anything involving alcohol, perfume, or...god forbid...sexual congress and spillage/transfer of bodily fluids while holidaying in my apartment! Because, not to be too snarky, yes, that actually does seem like a regular day in the operation of an accommodation business. I've even heard it rumored guests might leave the toilet in a less than pristine state... The horror! /ok, that was a bit snarky, but my point stands.
- camus2 10y ago
  > Regular AirBnB guests would never partake in anything involving alcohol, perfume, or...god forbid...sexual congress and spillage/transfer of bodily fluids while holidaying in my apartment! At least you can track who they are. That's entirely different from a guest setting up a gang bang in an apartment rented on Airbnb.
  - literallycancer 10y ago
    If a tourist rents a room, goes out to have fun and brings a girl back, you can still track only 1 person (and that's assuming they provided their real ID).
Fifer82 10y ago
He is welcome not to rent out his home. It isn't up to me to get the violins out.
bambax 10y ago
I don't understand your argument at all. If you rent your house to strangers then you're obviously okay with those people having sex at your place, in your bed, anywhere really where they fancy it. What's different if it's prostitution or if it isn't?? (Personally I would really prefer not having anyone I don't know engaging in any normal activity in my home, and that's why I will probably never be an Airbnb host; but if you are then surely you have to accept the consequences?)
- DanBC 10y ago
  The quantity of the cleanup; the increased risk of infected product; the increased risk of complaints from neighbours; the increased legal risk of running a brothel; etc. In this specific case it's not illegal for a woman to sell sex; it's not illegal for a woman to sell sex from a brothel; it is illegal to keep a brothel; or to let a property be used as a brothel.
  - yummyfajitas 10y ago
    The increased risk of disease/volume would also be true of a gay couple (statistically a vastly higher risk of HIV) with high stamina. Would you be similarly sympathetic if someone complained about such a situation? If not, this suggests your stated reasoning is faulty.
    - anjc 10y ago
      You think people should be sympathetic in the case that somebody chooses to put their health at risk via infection, just because the perpetrator is gay? Somebody has faulty reasoning here and it's not the poster you replied too.
      - foldr 10y ago
        Never thought I'd agree with yummyfajitas on anything, but you are missing his point entirely. Statistically, gay men are more likely to be HIV+ than the general population. Thus if a gay couple who were having safe sex in your apartment left behind lots of used condoms, there would statistically be a higher probability that those condoms contained HIV+ semen than with a couple chosen at random from the whole population. It has nothing to do with people deliberately engaging in risky behavior. For the sake of argument, we might say that the HIV+ person in the couple contracted HIV as the result of a date rape. (Not that I in any way endorse your judgmental suggestion that most people who get HIV somehow deserve it.)
9935c101ab17a66 10y ago
a) Cleaning up after strangers is part of renting out your living space through AirBnB. b) Please cite where in the article (which copiously and obviously employs hyperbole) it says that condoms were 'strewn about [the] house' Re: your edit - Stop pulling fictions figures out of thin air: Where in the article does it say dozens? Where does it say bodily ejections (apart from the description of the garbage overflowing with 'tissues and condoms'? - "Look at everybody pretending that cleaning up dozens of men's bodily ejections after they used your house as a brothel is just one of life's little chores." -- No one is saying that. First of all, look up the definition of brothel. It is somewhere that commonly/frequently plays host to prostitution. Escorts ALLEGEDLY using an apartment for sex over the span of tow nights does not a brothel make. Secondly, this is not 'one of life's little chores' because in the course of most people's lives, they do not rent out their apartments sight unseen to strangers over the internet. Yes, AirBnB is cool, and yes, you can use it to make extra money if you wish. But stop pretending like AirBnB hosts don't knowingly take on risk by making their apartment available to literally anyone who signs up on the site. They get paid for it and AirBnB have an insurance policy. What if a single couple had rented the apartment and left it in the same state after having non-stop sex? Could the host complain in the same way?
AlexAffe 10y ago
Bin overflowing. A wrapper under the bed. Hey, we're not talking about used needles and shit stains on the wall. This was a civilized night, they used protection, had some good wine and Prosecco... There is really nothing wrong with that, other than it might be a grayzone in airbnbs terms and the criminalization of prostitution...
- anjc 10y ago
  I wouldn't give two shits whether they used protection or not and couldn't care less if they ruin their life with drugs. They underhandedly used a person's house for illegal activity and left the owner to clean up afterwards. There's really no excusing it by trying to make it seem like a bunch of kids having a cool fun time. And the criminalisation of prostitution isn't a grey area, it's the law in that jurisdiction.
  - foldr 10y ago
    >And the criminalisation of prostitution isn't a grey area, it's the law in that jurisdiction. No. Prostitution per se is not against the law in the UK (except in Northern Ireland).
    - anjc 10y ago
      The prostitute might not be culpable for the sexual act itself but every activity surrounding prostitution is illegal. Soliciting, using a brothel, pimping, paying a prostitute etc. There's no getting around the fact that this guy's place was used for illegal activity.
      - foldr 10y ago
        No, paying a prostitute is not illegal in the UK. As for the rest, that's why the OP said "grey area". It's not entirely clear that they were doing any of the other stuff. See e.g. the 'legality' section in the following Wikipedia article. It's not black and white whether or not anything illegal was going on. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soho_walk-up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soho_walk-up
Mandatum 10y ago
Rent your house like a hotel, expect it to be treated as such. This isn't some family-friendly, socio-do-gooder website - it's AirBnB. They rent, they stay, they leave. Nothing was damaged in the apartment, I don't see the issue. If you don't like the mess, give a bad rating.

by anjc 10y ago

bingomad123 10y ago

Cleaning up reasonable trash is pretty much part of AirBnb host's job. So if a women throws her sanitary pads/tampoons in the trash will you call them names too ?

camus2 10y ago
What about the clients? do you really think it's a great environment for families? Once a place becomes a well known prostitution hub, it attracts a specific kind of people, and not the good ones.
- 2muchcoffeeman 10y ago
  Sex work is legal/decriminalised in Sydney. If you come from a country where it is illegal, you might be surprised how open it is around here. And right next to family friendly establishments, residential areas. It's pretty safe actually. Or at least no more dangerous than other parts of Sydney. I've never heard of any crimes or violence related to sex workers in Sydney. I'm more worried about alcohol and drug related violence. If there are any unsavoury characters about they are much more likely to be at a night club. Ban night clubs (they kind of did that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_lockout_laws https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_lockout_laws and it worked).
- ACow_Adonis 10y ago
  CEOs? Businessmen? Politicians? Founders? The physically disabled? Nervous silly college kids? Cheaters? Low lifes? I've got news for you, they might visit the brothels, but they live out in the burbs near you :P They live near all of us. Perhaps I'm just jaded/acclimatised from having worked in the suburb of Fyshwick in Canberra (where operating a brothel/in-home prostitution is quite common), knew there were prostitutes regularly working out of hotels/their own houses, and I'm pretty sure there's probably a couple of brothels around where I live. Honestly, I can't say I keep track of them...I can't say they're even on my mental radar... Don't misunderstand me, i know there are a significant number of people who wouldn't want to raise children in such an environment. But it doesn't bother me, nor the other families living here, and the general property prices around here suggest it doesn't sufficiently bother most of the people who live here :\ But I also knew prostitutes were working frequently out of suburban homes and hotels, so i'm a bit "you're not actually that far from prostitutes..." to all my suburban friends.
- bingomad123 10y ago
  > it's a great environment for families And why would anyone care if it is great environment for families ? Are US suburbs great environment for families where Ms. X who has 4 kids all from different people living with her boyfriend ? Is that a good environment ?
anjc 10y ago
Maybe yeah. It would rightly depend on how correctly and securely she disposes of her waste. Why are you trying to finagle a woman's analogous example as if that'll shame me into changing my mind...these prostitutes were women.

kalleboo 10y ago

People who aren't prostitutes also have sex in hotels you know. Not cleaning up after themselves is a valid complaint but doesn't seem something specific to prostitutes.

M_Grey 10y ago
Higher rates of STD's however... I'm all for legalization, but if you run a brothel out of my place I'm going to be seriously pissed off and not just get all libertarian about it. I will after all, have rented under non-commercial grounds anyway; I'd be pissed if you ran a pop-up restaurant there too.
- foldr 10y ago
  This STD argument is silly. You aren't going to get an STD from cleaning up used condoms.
  - M_Grey 10y ago
    Hep C is more than able to survive outside of the body (especially in a little pocket of nutrient-rich fluids) for quite some time (as in weeks). I grant you the odds of contracting it from even sexual contact, never mind casual contact with a condom is extremely low, but it's still a fucking biohazard you shouldn't have to deal with. The odds of being struck and killed by a bullet fired up into the air is vanishingly small too, but it's happened, and since it's unconscionable to randomly discharge your firearm into the air, it's unacceptable too. Needless to say, when you don't intend to rent your home out as a business, it's equally unacceptable if someone decides to use it as one. Edit: I... just realized how Freudian my analogy of "discharging firearms into the air" is. I really should get more sleep.
    - foldr 10y ago
      It's an insignificant risk. Virtually zero if you just use ordinary cleaning gloves. It surely can't be the risk of infection that is the issue here.

gambiting 10y ago

It's literally the bread and butter of working in a hotel. I don't see hotels complaining that their rooms are being used for sleeping with prostitutes or sex in general. I wouldn't expect guests of AirBnB to not do anything they would do in a hotel - after all you are attracting the same audience. Bottom line - if they left a mess, then call a cleaning company and charge the guests a cleaning fee. Pretty much every AirBnB has a cleaning fee in terms of rental. Would the reaction here be any different if an actual couple left the host with a pile of condoms? If yes,why? If no, why?

anjc 10y ago
Cleaning up after a prostitute's night of work is not the bread and butter of working in a hotel, and I'm sure that you would see staff and owners complaining about it if you talked to them.
- vertex-four 10y ago
  Cleaning up rather horrible messes of things people would rather not touch is, in fact, normal, albeit not the norm (i.e. it happens on a regular enough basis that it's not anything special, but most rooms are relatively ok).
  - anjc 10y ago
    Oh yeah of course, but I'm sure hotel owners and staff don't just tut and laugh and go "the prostitutes again haha", and don't particularly enjoy cleaning up after people who've used your facilities to make a lot of money illegally. As in...they'd turn down the custom if they could.
    - vertex-four 10y ago
      Sure, but if you have facilities open to the public you're going to get... the public. It's hardly just prostitutes that leave rooms in a state, after all. It's something you plan for, and you don't get to whine about having failed to plan for it.

ACow_Adonis 10y ago

Regular AirBnB guests would never partake in anything involving alcohol, perfume, or...god forbid...sexual congress and spillage/transfer of bodily fluids while holidaying in my apartment! Because, not to be too snarky, yes, that actually does seem like a regular day in the operation of an accommodation business. I've even heard it rumored guests might leave the toilet in a less than pristine state... The horror! /ok, that was a bit snarky, but my point stands.

camus2 10y ago
> Regular AirBnB guests would never partake in anything involving alcohol, perfume, or...god forbid...sexual congress and spillage/transfer of bodily fluids while holidaying in my apartment! At least you can track who they are. That's entirely different from a guest setting up a gang bang in an apartment rented on Airbnb.
- literallycancer 10y ago
  If a tourist rents a room, goes out to have fun and brings a girl back, you can still track only 1 person (and that's assuming they provided their real ID).

Fifer82 10y ago

He is welcome not to rent out his home. It isn't up to me to get the violins out.

bambax 10y ago

I don't understand your argument at all. If you rent your house to strangers then you're obviously okay with those people having sex at your place, in your bed, anywhere really where they fancy it. What's different if it's prostitution or if it isn't?? (Personally I would really prefer not having anyone I don't know engaging in any normal activity in my home, and that's why I will probably never be an Airbnb host; but if you are then surely you have to accept the consequences?)

DanBC 10y ago
The quantity of the cleanup; the increased risk of infected product; the increased risk of complaints from neighbours; the increased legal risk of running a brothel; etc. In this specific case it's not illegal for a woman to sell sex; it's not illegal for a woman to sell sex from a brothel; it is illegal to keep a brothel; or to let a property be used as a brothel.
- yummyfajitas 10y ago
  The increased risk of disease/volume would also be true of a gay couple (statistically a vastly higher risk of HIV) with high stamina. Would you be similarly sympathetic if someone complained about such a situation? If not, this suggests your stated reasoning is faulty.
  - anjc 10y ago
    You think people should be sympathetic in the case that somebody chooses to put their health at risk via infection, just because the perpetrator is gay? Somebody has faulty reasoning here and it's not the poster you replied too.
    - foldr 10y ago
      Never thought I'd agree with yummyfajitas on anything, but you are missing his point entirely. Statistically, gay men are more likely to be HIV+ than the general population. Thus if a gay couple who were having safe sex in your apartment left behind lots of used condoms, there would statistically be a higher probability that those condoms contained HIV+ semen than with a couple chosen at random from the whole population. It has nothing to do with people deliberately engaging in risky behavior. For the sake of argument, we might say that the HIV+ person in the couple contracted HIV as the result of a date rape. (Not that I in any way endorse your judgmental suggestion that most people who get HIV somehow deserve it.)

9935c101ab17a66 10y ago

a) Cleaning up after strangers is part of renting out your living space through AirBnB. b) Please cite where in the article (which copiously and obviously employs hyperbole) it says that condoms were 'strewn about [the] house' Re: your edit - Stop pulling fictions figures out of thin air: Where in the article does it say dozens? Where does it say bodily ejections (apart from the description of the garbage overflowing with 'tissues and condoms'? - "Look at everybody pretending that cleaning up dozens of men's bodily ejections after they used your house as a brothel is just one of life's little chores." -- No one is saying that. First of all, look up the definition of brothel. It is somewhere that commonly/frequently plays host to prostitution. Escorts ALLEGEDLY using an apartment for sex over the span of tow nights does not a brothel make. Secondly, this is not 'one of life's little chores' because in the course of most people's lives, they do not rent out their apartments sight unseen to strangers over the internet. Yes, AirBnB is cool, and yes, you can use it to make extra money if you wish. But stop pretending like AirBnB hosts don't knowingly take on risk by making their apartment available to literally anyone who signs up on the site. They get paid for it and AirBnB have an insurance policy. What if a single couple had rented the apartment and left it in the same state after having non-stop sex? Could the host complain in the same way?

AlexAffe 10y ago

Bin overflowing. A wrapper under the bed. Hey, we're not talking about used needles and shit stains on the wall. This was a civilized night, they used protection, had some good wine and Prosecco... There is really nothing wrong with that, other than it might be a grayzone in airbnbs terms and the criminalization of prostitution...

anjc 10y ago
I wouldn't give two shits whether they used protection or not and couldn't care less if they ruin their life with drugs. They underhandedly used a person's house for illegal activity and left the owner to clean up afterwards. There's really no excusing it by trying to make it seem like a bunch of kids having a cool fun time. And the criminalisation of prostitution isn't a grey area, it's the law in that jurisdiction.
- foldr 10y ago
  >And the criminalisation of prostitution isn't a grey area, it's the law in that jurisdiction. No. Prostitution per se is not against the law in the UK (except in Northern Ireland).
  - anjc 10y ago
    The prostitute might not be culpable for the sexual act itself but every activity surrounding prostitution is illegal. Soliciting, using a brothel, pimping, paying a prostitute etc. There's no getting around the fact that this guy's place was used for illegal activity.
    - foldr 10y ago
      No, paying a prostitute is not illegal in the UK. As for the rest, that's why the OP said "grey area". It's not entirely clear that they were doing any of the other stuff. See e.g. the 'legality' section in the following Wikipedia article. It's not black and white whether or not anything illegal was going on. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soho_walk-up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soho_walk-up

Mandatum 10y ago

Rent your house like a hotel, expect it to be treated as such. This isn't some family-friendly, socio-do-gooder website - it's AirBnB. They rent, they stay, they leave. Nothing was damaged in the apartment, I don't see the issue. If you don't like the mess, give a bad rating.