4 ms·

I hope I never hire someone like you by accident. I have a feeling it wouldn't take long until this outlook would lead to other problems in the workplace that w

by j2bax 10y ago

I hope I never hire someone like you by accident. I have a feeling it wouldn't take long until this outlook would lead to other problems in the workplace that would have you on to your next con.

krenden9 10y ago
Yes, because deceit runs through my soul and my heart is as black as damask cloth. The fact that I want to be paid what I feel I should and can be paid has no bearing on my performance and attitude at work. If you were to speak to any of my past employers, they would probably use the same sideways compliment my high school calc teacher wrote on a college recommendation: "brilliant, but like lightning in a bottle." You'd be fortunate to hire someone like me.
- j2bax 10y ago
  Honesty and integrity are pretty high on the list of qualities I like in people I associate and work with. The fact that you would conspire with your previous employer to artificially prop your value up and then tell a bold faced lie in an interview, does make it seem like you are not above doing whatever it takes to get what YOU want and feel you deserve.
  - stale2002 10y ago
    It is not propping up your value. If you interview someone and they ask for X, and you agree to hire them for X, then you have made the decision that he is worth X. That fact that he did not make X at his last job should have zero effect on his future job. If you do not think he is worth X, then don't hire him. He is either worth X or not.
    - thedufer 10y ago
      I don't see anyone arguing that your past salary should have any effect on your future comp. On the other hand, the position that a candidate seems to be with X, but is actually worth Y << X if they've down themselves to be dishonest in the interview process seems pretty reasonable. In places with good labor protection, lying during the hiring process is a great way to waive all protections from being fired.
  - krenden9 10y ago
    > make it seem like you are not above doing whatever it takes to get what YOU want and feel you deserve. Absolutely true. I'm also not an idiot and I apply this technique selectively. If I have to prevaricate to get something I want in a business setting, I have no problem with that. It's business, not a church confessional. However, when I'm at a company I align my desires with theirs and we BOTH get what we want. Honesty and integrity in a corporate environment is a myth. To succeed you just have to project an illusion of those qualities. This is especially true higher up in the ranks. Do you think your manager would tell you you're being laid off after having asked him? Hell no! He'll lie by omission or commission to save his skin. Is that honesty? Is there integrity in it? No! It's business. Get off your high horse. My life goal is to retire early so no one fucking tells me what to do with my time. It's working out so far, so I see no need to change my means.
  - kentrado 10y ago
    This kind of naive thinking only hurts good people. Bad people already know not to listen to you.
pixl97 10y ago
>I hope I never hire someone like you by accident. It's likely employers like you that force employees to lie. It's amazing when employers are handed resumes that are anonymized, such as names, race, and sex information are removed they choose resumes with less bias. Yet you refuse to see that pricing information will cause additional bias on your part.
- krenden9 10y ago
  > Yet you refuse to see that pricing information will cause additional bias on your part. This is why I chose to have my former employers give a different salary figure. If I had told my prospective, new employer I had been making $40k/year, I doubt they would have taken me seriously, and even possibly ended recruitment. "He only makes $40k! He must be bad or stupid!" I don't consider myself bad or stupid, I'm just not afraid of taking calculated risks.
  - j2bax 10y ago
    Or you could simply say, "I prefer not to disclose that information". If a potential employer continues to push you to make the first offer, you can dodge the bullet and walk away with your integrity intact. Personally, I never ask a candidate what they previously made. I do occasionally ask what their salary expectations are, but only when someone has applied that I perceive as far overqualified for the position they are applying for. e.g. Someone with a PHD and 20 years of experience applying for a Jr - Mid level position.
    - sqeaky 10y ago
      I find it so weird to see a lone person here defending integrity. Capitalism, the kind that enables startup culture, is built on trust. Starting an employment relationship with a lie is not good way to build trust. I don't think employers should ask this, and they do employees should hold it against them. Employees shouldn't disclose it unless they want too. Anyone lying about this or anything else in the all too brief hiring process should be enough of a red flag to make the other party consider leaving.
solotronics 10y ago
Employers should not be asking previous salary anyways. Its the same tactics aggressive car salesmen use. People should be paid what they are worth and this is a tactic to maximize corporate profit at the COST of individual suffering.
- FireBeyond 10y ago
  Yep. "How much are you looking to pay?" No, stop it. "You can probably discern by the cars that I'm looking at or asking about a good ballpark of my range and desires."
sneak 10y ago
It's not a con to negotiate a price and agree to it with mutual consent. Anchoring a prospective customer of your labor to a high price is not a con. Nothing forces them to take the deal. Please don't be a jerk.

by j2bax 10y ago

I hope I never hire someone like you by accident. I have a feeling it wouldn't take long until this outlook would lead to other problems in the workplace that would have you on to your next con.

krenden9 10y ago

Yes, because deceit runs through my soul and my heart is as black as damask cloth. The fact that I want to be paid what I feel I should and can be paid has no bearing on my performance and attitude at work. If you were to speak to any of my past employers, they would probably use the same sideways compliment my high school calc teacher wrote on a college recommendation: "brilliant, but like lightning in a bottle." You'd be fortunate to hire someone like me.

j2bax 10y ago
Honesty and integrity are pretty high on the list of qualities I like in people I associate and work with. The fact that you would conspire with your previous employer to artificially prop your value up and then tell a bold faced lie in an interview, does make it seem like you are not above doing whatever it takes to get what YOU want and feel you deserve.
- stale2002 10y ago
  It is not propping up your value. If you interview someone and they ask for X, and you agree to hire them for X, then you have made the decision that he is worth X. That fact that he did not make X at his last job should have zero effect on his future job. If you do not think he is worth X, then don't hire him. He is either worth X or not.
  - thedufer 10y ago
    I don't see anyone arguing that your past salary should have any effect on your future comp. On the other hand, the position that a candidate seems to be with X, but is actually worth Y << X if they've down themselves to be dishonest in the interview process seems pretty reasonable. In places with good labor protection, lying during the hiring process is a great way to waive all protections from being fired.
- krenden9 10y ago
  > make it seem like you are not above doing whatever it takes to get what YOU want and feel you deserve. Absolutely true. I'm also not an idiot and I apply this technique selectively. If I have to prevaricate to get something I want in a business setting, I have no problem with that. It's business, not a church confessional. However, when I'm at a company I align my desires with theirs and we BOTH get what we want. Honesty and integrity in a corporate environment is a myth. To succeed you just have to project an illusion of those qualities. This is especially true higher up in the ranks. Do you think your manager would tell you you're being laid off after having asked him? Hell no! He'll lie by omission or commission to save his skin. Is that honesty? Is there integrity in it? No! It's business. Get off your high horse. My life goal is to retire early so no one fucking tells me what to do with my time. It's working out so far, so I see no need to change my means.
- kentrado 10y ago
  This kind of naive thinking only hurts good people. Bad people already know not to listen to you.

pixl97 10y ago

>I hope I never hire someone like you by accident. It's likely employers like you that force employees to lie. It's amazing when employers are handed resumes that are anonymized, such as names, race, and sex information are removed they choose resumes with less bias. Yet you refuse to see that pricing information will cause additional bias on your part.

krenden9 10y ago
> Yet you refuse to see that pricing information will cause additional bias on your part. This is why I chose to have my former employers give a different salary figure. If I had told my prospective, new employer I had been making $40k/year, I doubt they would have taken me seriously, and even possibly ended recruitment. "He only makes $40k! He must be bad or stupid!" I don't consider myself bad or stupid, I'm just not afraid of taking calculated risks.
- j2bax 10y ago
  Or you could simply say, "I prefer not to disclose that information". If a potential employer continues to push you to make the first offer, you can dodge the bullet and walk away with your integrity intact. Personally, I never ask a candidate what they previously made. I do occasionally ask what their salary expectations are, but only when someone has applied that I perceive as far overqualified for the position they are applying for. e.g. Someone with a PHD and 20 years of experience applying for a Jr - Mid level position.
  - sqeaky 10y ago
    I find it so weird to see a lone person here defending integrity. Capitalism, the kind that enables startup culture, is built on trust. Starting an employment relationship with a lie is not good way to build trust. I don't think employers should ask this, and they do employees should hold it against them. Employees shouldn't disclose it unless they want too. Anyone lying about this or anything else in the all too brief hiring process should be enough of a red flag to make the other party consider leaving.

solotronics 10y ago

Employers should not be asking previous salary anyways. Its the same tactics aggressive car salesmen use. People should be paid what they are worth and this is a tactic to maximize corporate profit at the COST of individual suffering.

FireBeyond 10y ago
Yep. "How much are you looking to pay?" No, stop it. "You can probably discern by the cars that I'm looking at or asking about a good ballpark of my range and desires."

sneak 10y ago

It's not a con to negotiate a price and agree to it with mutual consent. Anchoring a prospective customer of your labor to a high price is not a con. Nothing forces them to take the deal. Please don't be a jerk.