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That's fair, the mentally ill did agree at the last big meeting that they were all on board with these tactics. More seriously, maybe next time stick to things

That's fair, the mentally ill did agree at the last big meeting that they were all on board with these tactics. More seriously, maybe next time stick to things (like self-promoters and drama queens) that people can actually walk away from? Shaming people for being mentally ill has been tried a lot as a treatment option. Shocking that it doesn't work.

dmix 10y ago
Not all mentally ill people need to be coddled and babied either. I learned that the hard way. Sometimes they are just hopelessly destructive to the people around them, and themselves, and the only 'solution' is to walk away from the relationship or keep it at a distance, otherwise it can be a black hole of wasted emotional energy and effort better left to professionals. Calling someone out for negative/destructive/selfish behaviour is not always 'shaming' them either. Mental illness is not a get away with anything card. I've also learned from personal experience that not all mental illness is static either, a lot can be done to minimize issues, for ex by medication and cognitive therapy. Just as I've found some people don't entirely benefit from such help/effort either. The key is finding the middle ground. But I do agree it's better to give someone with mental illness the benefit of the doubt things are not intentional. But this isn't always about blame or causation, we all have to live in the same world too.
- RangerScience 10y ago
  Approach relationships "sustainably". Literally, can you sustain what you are currently doing? If not, it will eventually end; with you, or with the relationship.
- johncolanduoni 10y ago
  Avoiding mentioning them in the same breath as "self-promoters and drama queens" is not remotely close to a get away with anything card. I think it's fair to criticize Leah's actions, and to extricate yourself from a person who is destructive to you even if the are mentally ill (I've had that experience as well). However, I'm a very not big fan of assigning blanket blame on the mentally ill.
redsummer 10y ago
It's a common response among many SJWs and mentally ill that any factual observation is 'shaming'.
- johncolanduoni 10y ago
  You assume I'm an SJW, or that I stand for exactly the same things most SJWs do. I don't, and I think a lot of people who call themselves SJWs are great at the social part and terrible at the justice part. I think a lot of SJWs are self-promoters and drama queens. Your factual observation that one of the causes that SJWs sometimes latch on to is the treatement of the mentally ill is not in dispute (by me anyway). However you've failed to provide a convincing argument that this is to be laid at the feet of the mentally ill, and not the self-promoting drama queens that claim to be fighting for social justice. To be honest, I think SJW advocacy on the part of the mentally ill is pretty feckless and unhelpful. I don't think you have to worry about mentally ill people gaining power from it, as their methods are far too dysfunctional.
  - redsummer 10y ago
    "I don't think you have to worry about mentally ill people gaining power from it" The Libreboot story contradicts this. Someone suffering from mental illness ("gender dysphoria") used SJW reasons to take over a project.
    - johncolanduoni 10y ago
      The post makes clear she was already a single point of failure in the project's power structure well before the allegations were made. Unless you have some facts that indicate it was her mental illness that was responsible for her "rise to power", your conclusion is not justified by evidence. In any case, if you care about reason and truth it was disingenuous of you to make that assertion with no attempt to support it. It's a common tactic of overzealous critics of SJWs to categorize their own assertions as "facts" when they are just opposite opinions.
      - 10y ago

dmix 10y ago

Not all mentally ill people need to be coddled and babied either. I learned that the hard way. Sometimes they are just hopelessly destructive to the people around them, and themselves, and the only 'solution' is to walk away from the relationship or keep it at a distance, otherwise it can be a black hole of wasted emotional energy and effort better left to professionals. Calling someone out for negative/destructive/selfish behaviour is not always 'shaming' them either. Mental illness is not a get away with anything card. I've also learned from personal experience that not all mental illness is static either, a lot can be done to minimize issues, for ex by medication and cognitive therapy. Just as I've found some people don't entirely benefit from such help/effort either. The key is finding the middle ground. But I do agree it's better to give someone with mental illness the benefit of the doubt things are not intentional. But this isn't always about blame or causation, we all have to live in the same world too.

RangerScience 10y ago
Approach relationships "sustainably". Literally, can you sustain what you are currently doing? If not, it will eventually end; with you, or with the relationship.
johncolanduoni 10y ago
Avoiding mentioning them in the same breath as "self-promoters and drama queens" is not remotely close to a get away with anything card. I think it's fair to criticize Leah's actions, and to extricate yourself from a person who is destructive to you even if the are mentally ill (I've had that experience as well). However, I'm a very not big fan of assigning blanket blame on the mentally ill.

redsummer 10y ago

It's a common response among many SJWs and mentally ill that any factual observation is 'shaming'.

johncolanduoni 10y ago
You assume I'm an SJW, or that I stand for exactly the same things most SJWs do. I don't, and I think a lot of people who call themselves SJWs are great at the social part and terrible at the justice part. I think a lot of SJWs are self-promoters and drama queens. Your factual observation that one of the causes that SJWs sometimes latch on to is the treatement of the mentally ill is not in dispute (by me anyway). However you've failed to provide a convincing argument that this is to be laid at the feet of the mentally ill, and not the self-promoting drama queens that claim to be fighting for social justice. To be honest, I think SJW advocacy on the part of the mentally ill is pretty feckless and unhelpful. I don't think you have to worry about mentally ill people gaining power from it, as their methods are far too dysfunctional.
- redsummer 10y ago
  "I don't think you have to worry about mentally ill people gaining power from it" The Libreboot story contradicts this. Someone suffering from mental illness ("gender dysphoria") used SJW reasons to take over a project.
  - johncolanduoni 10y ago
    The post makes clear she was already a single point of failure in the project's power structure well before the allegations were made. Unless you have some facts that indicate it was her mental illness that was responsible for her "rise to power", your conclusion is not justified by evidence. In any case, if you care about reason and truth it was disingenuous of you to make that assertion with no attempt to support it. It's a common tactic of overzealous critics of SJWs to categorize their own assertions as "facts" when they are just opposite opinions.
    - 10y ago