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So if I am reading this right, LSD reduced fearful reactions. I initially mis-read it as a correlation between LSD and fear. Part of the reason psychedelics is

So if I am reading this right, LSD reduced fearful reactions. I initially mis-read it as a correlation between LSD and fear. Part of the reason psychedelics is kept away from treatment is because of those occasional bad reactions. You never know who might get a bad trip and for what reason. I wish psychedelics were researched without the baggage of "possible treatment". This would allow for the study for it's own sake, imho. If anyone is interested in reading some first time experiences of random first time users here is a link. [0] ------------------- [0] https://erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_LSD_First_Times.shtml https://erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_LSD_First_Times.shtm...

rubatuga 10y ago
Definitely agree with you about the possibility of an unexpected reaction: I had to experience my friend losing touch with reality, taking off his clothes, running around my dormitory almost naked, and finally pulling the fire alarm. He was last seen that day being handcuffed and put into an ambulance. In case you're wondering, he took about 200 ug of real LSD.
- corndoge 10y ago
  Had an almost identical experience with a somewhat seasoned tripper. More blood though.
- rjeli 10y ago
  I've never really understood these stories of people completely dissociating and doing crazy things. At high doses I can barely walk.
  - always_good 10y ago
    I've started avoiding any thread on Reddit where LSD comes up. People talk about taking a milligram of it and walking around the city enjoying fractals while their friend repeats the phrase "I see Candyland" for 12 hours straight, and their other friend thought he was a chicken and started flapping his arms, "bok bok bok!" And everyone in the comments laughs and says "yeah, isn't acid crazy?" With defenses like "drugs affect everyone differently!" or "acid is known to cause insanity, albeit rarely!" invoked whenever you roll your eyes. Too cringeworthy for me. Starting to see it on HN now as well.
    - rubatuga 10y ago
      ... I joined HN because Reddit was starting to piss me off ;) . But I really stand by what I said, it was real LSD, and his experience was a minority and extreme case. I'm just trying to say LSD does not affect everybody the same way.
- NikolaeVarius 10y ago
  I don't understand how this is possible. I find it almost legitimately impossible to ever act in this way. This feels more like they got some bad stuff.
  - corndoge 10y ago
    That sentiment is tempting, but unfortunately the "good stuff" does actually occasionally cause insane reactions in some people, even in people who have had perfectly nominal trips on exactly the same batch of substance.
- Chathamization 10y ago
  Hmm. This suggest that 200ug is a relatively strong dose[1] (the dose used in this study is 100ug). It's worth noting that a lot of things - alcohol, marijuana, even Robitussin (DXM) - can have very unpleasant side effects when the dose is too large. Drugs like caffeine and alcohol also have a much greater toxicity than LSD, for what it's worth. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/2hg6io/different_dosage_of_lsd_explained_from_20ug1500ug/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/2hg6io/different_dosag...
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- jlg23 10y ago
  200ug are a pretty high dose[1], 10 to 20 times the threshold and your friend's reaction is not really typical even for a bad trip: In most cases people just want to reduce the amount of auditory or visual input they have to process when it is too much - so nothing like starting a fire alarm. Are you sure it was LSD? [1] https://erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_dose.shtml https://erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_dose.shtml
  - someonewhocar3s 10y ago
    200ug is not high...? Starting a fire alarm etc. just means the guy was using the reduced inhibition to go ballastic. Just stupid really. Don't go blame the stuff for that. >400 is high. up to 150/200 is low - can function normally. between 200/400 is hard to function normally. above 400 you really kinda can't, best just lie down and let the colors wash over.
    - fdsfsafasfdas 10y ago
      High for what barrier? 200µg is certainly enough to perceive the world radically differently—so, very high to a sober person. However, it's very low on the scale of LSD you can safely ingest. Either way, the dude had more going on than an acid trip that day.
  - tessierashpool 10y ago
    I share your skepticism. Part of the problem with the War on Drugs is that forcing science underground basically puts us in a medieval situation, where we have to rely on word of mouth and personal experiences. It doesn't sound like LSD to me either, but all I can say for sure is that I took a whole bunch of stuff which people told me was LSD, back in the day, and that it affected me differently. edit: skepticism significantly increased, now that people are talking about LSD causing reduced inhibitions. seen and experienced extraordinary counterexamples. it's not alcohol, folks.
  - rubatuga 10y ago
    It was bought off of the dark web with a seller with a very high rating, and was taken by multiple other friends who had a true LSD experience. He was the only one who had a "crazy" reaction. I'm hundred percent sure it was LSD. Talking to him after the event, I remember him saying that he believed he could do anything. Mind you, watching him felt like seeing a toddler in a grown mans body. I'm not sure if LSD necessarily lowers inhibition, but it did seem to confirm that different brain chemistries exist.
- openfuture 10y ago
  That doesn't sound at all strange to me, the drug makes you lose touch with reality (sort of by definition) and taking of your clothes is a common LSD trope, pulling the fire alarm is unfortunate but not so serious. Describing this like it's some sad event and a huge deal is weird to me, I hope the guy didn't have to suffer too much prejudice afterwards.
return0 10y ago
'Possible treatment' is almost a requirement to publish to these journals. Its usually some fluff added for that effect. Besides, one can easily make a connection to disease, however remote
thisisforyou 10y ago
> "So if I am reading this right, LSD reduced fearful reactions. I initially mis-read it as a correlation between LSD and fear." Not really, the results were a bit more subtle and technical than that. They just found that there was a (fairly small) negative correlation on left amygdalar BOLD signal in the active group. They did not measure subjective fear, nor did they make any explicit claims about it. Just because blood oxygen levels changed does not mean the participants necessarily experienced less fear or anything different from the placebo group (in terms of fear at least). The authors also mention toward the end of the paper that this was a fairly small dose, and that larger doses would likely induce more anxiety than placebo: "Third, we can only provide data about one moderate dose. Higher doses of psychedelics are possibly difficult to use with fMRI, because they are more likely to induce anxiety,45 although the overall effects are still described as positive in the higher doses investigated.2, 45 The observed anxiolytic effect probably also depends on personal and environmental factors and might thus be different in the mentally ill or in uncontrolled settings."
empath75 10y ago
Yeah, psychedelics in general seem to be a useful tool for understanding consciousness, whether or not they're clinically useful.
senorjazz 10y ago
Erowid are currently asking for donations to keep running: https://erowid.org/donations/donations.php https://erowid.org/donations/donations.php Anyway who has used them over the years and hope they are around for future generations, consider giving as they are more important than ever with the explosion in RCs and analogues where a slight mishap in dosage can result in death
- imesh 10y ago
  Erowid stopped my experimental teenage years from becoming disastrous/addiction/overdose years and I know it's done the same for thousands if not millions.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

rubatuga 10y ago

Definitely agree with you about the possibility of an unexpected reaction: I had to experience my friend losing touch with reality, taking off his clothes, running around my dormitory almost naked, and finally pulling the fire alarm. He was last seen that day being handcuffed and put into an ambulance. In case you're wondering, he took about 200 ug of real LSD.

corndoge 10y ago
Had an almost identical experience with a somewhat seasoned tripper. More blood though.
rjeli 10y ago
I've never really understood these stories of people completely dissociating and doing crazy things. At high doses I can barely walk.
- always_good 10y ago
  I've started avoiding any thread on Reddit where LSD comes up. People talk about taking a milligram of it and walking around the city enjoying fractals while their friend repeats the phrase "I see Candyland" for 12 hours straight, and their other friend thought he was a chicken and started flapping his arms, "bok bok bok!" And everyone in the comments laughs and says "yeah, isn't acid crazy?" With defenses like "drugs affect everyone differently!" or "acid is known to cause insanity, albeit rarely!" invoked whenever you roll your eyes. Too cringeworthy for me. Starting to see it on HN now as well.
  - rubatuga 10y ago
    ... I joined HN because Reddit was starting to piss me off ;) . But I really stand by what I said, it was real LSD, and his experience was a minority and extreme case. I'm just trying to say LSD does not affect everybody the same way.
NikolaeVarius 10y ago
I don't understand how this is possible. I find it almost legitimately impossible to ever act in this way. This feels more like they got some bad stuff.
- corndoge 10y ago
  That sentiment is tempting, but unfortunately the "good stuff" does actually occasionally cause insane reactions in some people, even in people who have had perfectly nominal trips on exactly the same batch of substance.
Chathamization 10y ago
Hmm. This suggest that 200ug is a relatively strong dose[1] (the dose used in this study is 100ug). It's worth noting that a lot of things - alcohol, marijuana, even Robitussin (DXM) - can have very unpleasant side effects when the dose is too large. Drugs like caffeine and alcohol also have a much greater toxicity than LSD, for what it's worth. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/2hg6io/different_dosage_of_lsd_explained_from_20ug1500ug/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/2hg6io/different_dosag...
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
jlg23 10y ago
200ug are a pretty high dose[1], 10 to 20 times the threshold and your friend's reaction is not really typical even for a bad trip: In most cases people just want to reduce the amount of auditory or visual input they have to process when it is too much - so nothing like starting a fire alarm. Are you sure it was LSD? [1] https://erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_dose.shtml https://erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_dose.shtml
- someonewhocar3s 10y ago
  200ug is not high...? Starting a fire alarm etc. just means the guy was using the reduced inhibition to go ballastic. Just stupid really. Don't go blame the stuff for that. >400 is high. up to 150/200 is low - can function normally. between 200/400 is hard to function normally. above 400 you really kinda can't, best just lie down and let the colors wash over.
  - fdsfsafasfdas 10y ago
    High for what barrier? 200µg is certainly enough to perceive the world radically differently—so, very high to a sober person. However, it's very low on the scale of LSD you can safely ingest. Either way, the dude had more going on than an acid trip that day.
- tessierashpool 10y ago
  I share your skepticism. Part of the problem with the War on Drugs is that forcing science underground basically puts us in a medieval situation, where we have to rely on word of mouth and personal experiences. It doesn't sound like LSD to me either, but all I can say for sure is that I took a whole bunch of stuff which people told me was LSD, back in the day, and that it affected me differently. edit: skepticism significantly increased, now that people are talking about LSD causing reduced inhibitions. seen and experienced extraordinary counterexamples. it's not alcohol, folks.
- rubatuga 10y ago
  It was bought off of the dark web with a seller with a very high rating, and was taken by multiple other friends who had a true LSD experience. He was the only one who had a "crazy" reaction. I'm hundred percent sure it was LSD. Talking to him after the event, I remember him saying that he believed he could do anything. Mind you, watching him felt like seeing a toddler in a grown mans body. I'm not sure if LSD necessarily lowers inhibition, but it did seem to confirm that different brain chemistries exist.
openfuture 10y ago
That doesn't sound at all strange to me, the drug makes you lose touch with reality (sort of by definition) and taking of your clothes is a common LSD trope, pulling the fire alarm is unfortunate but not so serious. Describing this like it's some sad event and a huge deal is weird to me, I hope the guy didn't have to suffer too much prejudice afterwards.

return0 10y ago

'Possible treatment' is almost a requirement to publish to these journals. Its usually some fluff added for that effect. Besides, one can easily make a connection to disease, however remote

thisisforyou 10y ago

> "So if I am reading this right, LSD reduced fearful reactions. I initially mis-read it as a correlation between LSD and fear." Not really, the results were a bit more subtle and technical than that. They just found that there was a (fairly small) negative correlation on left amygdalar BOLD signal in the active group. They did not measure subjective fear, nor did they make any explicit claims about it. Just because blood oxygen levels changed does not mean the participants necessarily experienced less fear or anything different from the placebo group (in terms of fear at least). The authors also mention toward the end of the paper that this was a fairly small dose, and that larger doses would likely induce more anxiety than placebo: "Third, we can only provide data about one moderate dose. Higher doses of psychedelics are possibly difficult to use with fMRI, because they are more likely to induce anxiety,45 although the overall effects are still described as positive in the higher doses investigated.2, 45 The observed anxiolytic effect probably also depends on personal and environmental factors and might thus be different in the mentally ill or in uncontrolled settings."

empath75 10y ago

Yeah, psychedelics in general seem to be a useful tool for understanding consciousness, whether or not they're clinically useful.

senorjazz 10y ago

Erowid are currently asking for donations to keep running: https://erowid.org/donations/donations.php https://erowid.org/donations/donations.php Anyway who has used them over the years and hope they are around for future generations, consider giving as they are more important than ever with the explosion in RCs and analogues where a slight mishap in dosage can result in death

imesh 10y ago
Erowid stopped my experimental teenage years from becoming disastrous/addiction/overdose years and I know it's done the same for thousands if not millions.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]