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but hacker news isn't really about social content. Some of that might creep in for some users, and yes the karma thing does pollute motivations for some, but I

but hacker news isn't really about social content. Some of that might creep in for some users, and yes the karma thing does pollute motivations for some, but I've never thought of it as a social network. Some networking is done here, but only indirectly I think. Maybe I'm not thinking about it right or use it differently than most :P

fiatjaf 10y ago
Yeah, it is not a "complete" social network, I was just using it as an example that there are places in which people aren't so narcissistic as in Facebook. See also Joel Spolsky on the topic: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2003/03/03/building-communities-with-software/ https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2003/03/03/building-communiti...
- lj3 10y ago
  People are narcissistic by design. Social Networks were created to harness that narcissism to make money. I argue that there are a lot of other 'social networks' on the internet in a technical sense. You had profiles and added friends and then sent things to them/chatted with them on AIM, LiveJournal, any of a number of message boards, blogs/comments, etc. The deciding factor between what came before and facebook and twitter is the ability to broadcast to the entire social network at once, so all of the world can see your brilliance! Feeding into that narcissism is the killer feature of modern social networks.
fiatjaf 10y ago
You have a point there. "Social content". What is "social content"? Is it people talking about themselves and what they think and showing pictures of themselves? Is that what you do with your best friends? You arrive at their houses and start talking about yourself without being asked?
- allannienhuis 10y ago
  hmm. I think people expect their friends to do some posting about their life or interests on (our current) social networks - so they implicitly have permission to do so. We don't expect our friends to immediately start talking about themselves in-person, but I do think we expect our friends to talk about themselves and what's going on in their lives - it would be pretty shallow friendships if we only talked about the weather or the news headlines. Most good conversationalists are good at it because they explicitly draw the other person into talking about themselves and their interests. Whether things become narcissistic is more a factor of personality I think. Perhaps its more than that, though. A good conversationalist would steer the conversation to more interesting content - ie why he person is passionate about their hobby rather than just talking about their accomplishments. Perhaps we need to think about social network features that model what good conversationalists do? Not sure what that looks like though. [edit for typo]
- Touche 10y ago
  No, that's not what I (and presumably you and others here) do. We are nerds. We like talking about things that make us think. But yes, for the majority of people, talking about themselves is exactly what they do. They talk about their vacation to the beach. They talk about the drama going on at work. They talk about their sister's date. They don't talk about advances in database design. I was at a live event (a play) recently and was fascinated by a small group of women in their late 20s / early 30s. They spent a good 10-15 minutes before the play started just taking pictures of themselves being at the play and posting it to their social networks. They talked about the pictures, asked others to send them their copy of the picture. They took pictures from one angle and then another. They talked about who "liked" the picture they just uploaded. It went on and on and on. Not once did I overhear them talking about the play they were about to see. It seemed to be not the point at all. The play was just a hashtag for their social media posts.
  - fiatjaf 10y ago
    Ok, you're probably right, but I don't want to believe it.

fiatjaf 10y ago

Yeah, it is not a "complete" social network, I was just using it as an example that there are places in which people aren't so narcissistic as in Facebook. See also Joel Spolsky on the topic: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2003/03/03/building-communities-with-software/ https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2003/03/03/building-communiti...

lj3 10y ago
People are narcissistic by design. Social Networks were created to harness that narcissism to make money. I argue that there are a lot of other 'social networks' on the internet in a technical sense. You had profiles and added friends and then sent things to them/chatted with them on AIM, LiveJournal, any of a number of message boards, blogs/comments, etc. The deciding factor between what came before and facebook and twitter is the ability to broadcast to the entire social network at once, so all of the world can see your brilliance! Feeding into that narcissism is the killer feature of modern social networks.

fiatjaf 10y ago

You have a point there. "Social content". What is "social content"? Is it people talking about themselves and what they think and showing pictures of themselves? Is that what you do with your best friends? You arrive at their houses and start talking about yourself without being asked?

allannienhuis 10y ago
hmm. I think people expect their friends to do some posting about their life or interests on (our current) social networks - so they implicitly have permission to do so. We don't expect our friends to immediately start talking about themselves in-person, but I do think we expect our friends to talk about themselves and what's going on in their lives - it would be pretty shallow friendships if we only talked about the weather or the news headlines. Most good conversationalists are good at it because they explicitly draw the other person into talking about themselves and their interests. Whether things become narcissistic is more a factor of personality I think. Perhaps its more than that, though. A good conversationalist would steer the conversation to more interesting content - ie why he person is passionate about their hobby rather than just talking about their accomplishments. Perhaps we need to think about social network features that model what good conversationalists do? Not sure what that looks like though. [edit for typo]
Touche 10y ago
No, that's not what I (and presumably you and others here) do. We are nerds. We like talking about things that make us think. But yes, for the majority of people, talking about themselves is exactly what they do. They talk about their vacation to the beach. They talk about the drama going on at work. They talk about their sister's date. They don't talk about advances in database design. I was at a live event (a play) recently and was fascinated by a small group of women in their late 20s / early 30s. They spent a good 10-15 minutes before the play started just taking pictures of themselves being at the play and posting it to their social networks. They talked about the pictures, asked others to send them their copy of the picture. They took pictures from one angle and then another. They talked about who "liked" the picture they just uploaded. It went on and on and on. Not once did I overhear them talking about the play they were about to see. It seemed to be not the point at all. The play was just a hashtag for their social media posts.
- fiatjaf 10y ago
  Ok, you're probably right, but I don't want to believe it.