5 ms·

VPN's aren't easy - and they're definitely not a default behavior in the same way not accepting third-party cookies is. But part of the solution if the regulat

by nikcub 10y ago

VPN's aren't easy - and they're definitely not a default behavior in the same way not accepting third-party cookies is. But part of the solution if the regulations stay the way they are may well be that VPNs are made easier by being built into operating systems and provided by for ex. Apple as part of iCloud > You can't easily avoid emailing people with gmail accounts, or communicating with people on Android phones. I'm genuinely curious if you have a cite on Google using received emails in ad targeting. Likewise with receiving messages on Android devices - because neither are in their privacy policy[0]. Google do run services that aren't part of the ad targeting dragnet - partly because a lot of the data is useless if you're not a Google user and not terribly additionally useful if you are a Google customer > using e.g. browser fingerprinting techniques. The article you linked to talks about Google and Facebook using SSO. Actual browser fingerprinting to bypass user privacy settings is illegal. There are many cases of the FTC smacking companies down for that.[1][2][3][4] [0] https://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ https://www.google.com/policies/privacy/ [1] https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2012/08/google-will-pay-225-million-settle-ftc-charges-it-misrepresented https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2012/08/googl... [2] https://www.mediapost.com/publications/article/191409/kissmetrics-finalizes-supercookies-settlement.html https://www.mediapost.com/publications/article/191409/kissme... [3] https://www.mediapost.com/publications/article/291523/turn-settles-ftc-charges-over-supercookies.html https://www.mediapost.com/publications/article/291523/turn-s... [4] https://www.engadget.com/2016/12/20/ftc-tells-verizon-supercookie-partner-to-give-you-an-exit/ https://www.engadget.com/2016/12/20/ftc-tells-verizon-superc...

mirimir 10y ago
> VPN's aren't easy - and they're definitely not a default behavior in the same way not accepting third-party cookies is. If you can buy something from Amazon, you can lease a VPN service. If you can download and install some silly game, you can download and install a VPN client. Which just works. So yes, it's easy. To opt out of third-party cookies, you actually need to tweak browser preferences. How is that easier than pay, download and install?
- kharms 10y ago
  I'm pretty tech literate, and even so getting an VPN is a huge pain. First, there is the trade off of speed, location, protocol. Will a US based VPN be private enough? Do they really not log? Who do I trust? Next there is actual usage: my Phillips hue lights don't sync with my alarm if the VPN is turned on. Torrents don't work if the VPN isn't on the slowest protocol. A few more in that vein. This means that even after I've found and paid for a VPN I think I can trust, I have to be constantly switching it on and off, and have to be vigilant about what browsing I do when.
  - dboreham 10y ago
    And you need to curate a fistful of routing rules to ensure your streaming traffic doesn't go down the VPN (no VPN provider wants your 20Mbit of Downton Abbey season 5 and you want that traffic to hit the CDN node down the street).
    - mirimir 10y ago
      Or you could just disconnect the VPN while streaming. Or use different devices with and without VPN.
      - matt4077 10y ago
        Yes, all that seems to indeed be exactly as easy as not changing the defaults my browser came with.
        mirimir 10y ago
        My claim was that changing the defaults was harder than installing VPNs. I mean, there are lots of things that you could change. Firefox has simplified the GUI, but there's a ton of enigmatic stuff in about:config. Using VPNs for basic browsing, messaging, email etc is indeed trivial. There's basically an on/off button.
  - mirimir 10y ago
rayiner 10y ago
> I'm genuinely curious if you have a cite on Google using received emails in ad targeting. The point is, just as with ISPs, whether you can "opt out" of Google depends entirely on what Google chooses to do or not do (in the future, if not now). Even if you don't use Google services, its almost impossible to not send information to those who do. When I first saw ads on Google fifteen years ago I never expected that it'd be tracking me across the Internet and reading all the mail I send my family, but here we are. > Actual browser fingerprinting to bypass user privacy settings is illegal. Source? All your links relate to misrepresentations in disclosure, not the underlying practice being illegal.
- x0x0 10y ago
  I worked for a company that was sued for something similar, and as far as I could tell, you're right. You can do nearly any tracking you like, you just have to be honest about it in your privacy policy. If your privacy policy says "we're gonna look down your pants if we can figure out how", I think you're pretty much free to do so.

by nikcub 10y ago

mirimir 10y ago

> VPN's aren't easy - and they're definitely not a default behavior in the same way not accepting third-party cookies is. If you can buy something from Amazon, you can lease a VPN service. If you can download and install some silly game, you can download and install a VPN client. Which just works. So yes, it's easy. To opt out of third-party cookies, you actually need to tweak browser preferences. How is that easier than pay, download and install?

kharms 10y ago
I'm pretty tech literate, and even so getting an VPN is a huge pain. First, there is the trade off of speed, location, protocol. Will a US based VPN be private enough? Do they really not log? Who do I trust? Next there is actual usage: my Phillips hue lights don't sync with my alarm if the VPN is turned on. Torrents don't work if the VPN isn't on the slowest protocol. A few more in that vein. This means that even after I've found and paid for a VPN I think I can trust, I have to be constantly switching it on and off, and have to be vigilant about what browsing I do when.
- dboreham 10y ago
  And you need to curate a fistful of routing rules to ensure your streaming traffic doesn't go down the VPN (no VPN provider wants your 20Mbit of Downton Abbey season 5 and you want that traffic to hit the CDN node down the street).
  - mirimir 10y ago
    Or you could just disconnect the VPN while streaming. Or use different devices with and without VPN.
    - matt4077 10y ago
      Yes, all that seems to indeed be exactly as easy as not changing the defaults my browser came with.
      - mirimir 10y ago
        My claim was that changing the defaults was harder than installing VPNs. I mean, there are lots of things that you could change. Firefox has simplified the GUI, but there's a ton of enigmatic stuff in about:config. Using VPNs for basic browsing, messaging, email etc is indeed trivial. There's basically an on/off button.
- mirimir 10y ago

rayiner 10y ago

> I'm genuinely curious if you have a cite on Google using received emails in ad targeting. The point is, just as with ISPs, whether you can "opt out" of Google depends entirely on what Google chooses to do or not do (in the future, if not now). Even if you don't use Google services, its almost impossible to not send information to those who do. When I first saw ads on Google fifteen years ago I never expected that it'd be tracking me across the Internet and reading all the mail I send my family, but here we are. > Actual browser fingerprinting to bypass user privacy settings is illegal. Source? All your links relate to misrepresentations in disclosure, not the underlying practice being illegal.

x0x0 10y ago
I worked for a company that was sued for something similar, and as far as I could tell, you're right. You can do nearly any tracking you like, you just have to be honest about it in your privacy policy. If your privacy policy says "we're gonna look down your pants if we can figure out how", I think you're pretty much free to do so.