5 ms·

Being publicly critical of a former employer like this, unless you're talking about major ethical issues, seems like a bad move. There's just no way to do it wi

by danaliv 10y ago

Being publicly critical of a former employer like this, unless you're talking about major ethical issues, seems like a bad move. There's just no way to do it without it coming across as sour grapes. If you have constructive criticism because you believe in a company and want them to do better, give it directly to the people involved. Otherwise I just have to wonder what the real motive is behind making a public statement like this.

princekolt 10y ago
> The cherry on top of this disastrous situation was that throughout the entire process I only heard good things from my manager. In total I had 3 1-on-1's with him, and even though we discussed the situation and what was wrong multiple times, he never, for one moment, gave me the impression that my job could be in jeopardy. A few weeks later I was fired. This doesn't look like a company that takes direct criticism seriously enough.
- danaliv 10y ago
  Then don't waste your time. The point is, a public post like this reads badly.
  - Retric 10y ago
    I disagree, I am more likely to hier the guy after reeding this post as I want someone to know when they need help. And more importantly be willing to speak up.
    - cocktailpeanuts 10y ago
      Do you run a company? Or have you run a company? I can't imagine anyone having run a company say they'll hire this person. Whether this guy was right or wrong is subjective, and people have opinions, but this type of attitude is so obviously toxic that this is almost a pattern. There's a huge difference in someone who tell the truth to the one who needs to hear, and someone who posts it on one of these medium posts hoping that they can hurt them somehow.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
barce 10y ago
Yet, at the same time I would think twice before working at gitlab now. I feel the CEO or HR should have had an NDA in place with a generous severance. Also, I would be hesitant about hiring the engineer. He was given a great challenge, but instead of rising to it, he made up excuses about needing mentorship. At the very least, he could've generalized the problem, and made an open source library as leverage for finding an even better job. Yes, he still might've gotten fired, but at least he'd have a tool he could call his own.
- GiorgioG 10y ago
  > He was given a great challenge, but instead of rising to it, he made excuses... It sounds like he worked his butt off, what more do you expect? I don't scale mountains for my employer, I do what is reasonably asked of me - and it sounds like he did just that. Sounds like a typical chaotic startup culture growing too fast for its own good, not paying attention or supporting its employees' needs.
  - cocktailpeanuts 10y ago
    > It sounds like he worked his butt off, what more do you expect? And where did you learn that? From this blog post? You use awful lot of "sounds like" in your comment. "Sounds like" is not enough of certainty to criticize someone.
mattbee 10y ago
On the flip-side, never let one of your staff leave your company so unhappy they write a hit-piece. As a CEO you'll know if your company has been a less-than-great manager to a member of staff. (If don't have lots of written evidence that you've been managing them well ... you've probably been managing them badly.) This guy is pained he wasn't able to contribute as Gitlab grew. You can't always bring someone round as a company changes shape, but you can be kind & generous if you need to fire them.
- e40 10y ago
  On the flip-side, never let one of your staff leave your company so unhappy they write a hit-piece. In a world where everyone is reasonable, that's good advice. There are some people you can't reason with. What I'd look for here, if I were working at Gitlab (I'm not): is there a pattern? If not, then don't worry about it. If there is, then worry. I've seen bad exits that were the fault of the company, and ones that weren't.
hn_throwaway_99 10y ago
As a development manager, I agree. Even assuming everything he says is 100% true, his main goal still just feels like venting. Which is fine, but you should vent to friends, not in a public forum like this. It would make me question his maturity.
spacelizard 10y ago
>Otherwise I just have to wonder what the real motive is behind making a public statement like this. What is the motivation for blogging about anything? I am extremely disappointed that we are still stuck culturally in this situation where we can't have healthy public discourse about these things, where private businesses can get away with whatever they want and then proceed to threaten people for even trying to talk about it. Maybe it is sour grapes, so what? The emotional highs and lows are part of the package when it comes to startups, and hiding them doesn't do any good.
fred_is_fred 10y ago
There's very little gain for you to: - criticize them publicly - "give feedback directly" - whistleblowing There's a bad ending to all those cases ranging from them blowing you off as a guy who got fired to lawsuits. I've always politely declined exit interviews as they offer me zero value and while I may have complained about a company over a beer, I've not blogged about it.
nojvek 10y ago
I think this is great for the rest of the developer community getting first hand feedback like this. Why would another developer want to work for GitLab? Same with Uber.

by danaliv 10y ago

princekolt 10y ago

> The cherry on top of this disastrous situation was that throughout the entire process I only heard good things from my manager. In total I had 3 1-on-1's with him, and even though we discussed the situation and what was wrong multiple times, he never, for one moment, gave me the impression that my job could be in jeopardy. A few weeks later I was fired. This doesn't look like a company that takes direct criticism seriously enough.

danaliv 10y ago
Then don't waste your time. The point is, a public post like this reads badly.
- Retric 10y ago
  I disagree, I am more likely to hier the guy after reeding this post as I want someone to know when they need help. And more importantly be willing to speak up.
  - cocktailpeanuts 10y ago
    Do you run a company? Or have you run a company? I can't imagine anyone having run a company say they'll hire this person. Whether this guy was right or wrong is subjective, and people have opinions, but this type of attitude is so obviously toxic that this is almost a pattern. There's a huge difference in someone who tell the truth to the one who needs to hear, and someone who posts it on one of these medium posts hoping that they can hurt them somehow.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]

barce 10y ago

Yet, at the same time I would think twice before working at gitlab now. I feel the CEO or HR should have had an NDA in place with a generous severance. Also, I would be hesitant about hiring the engineer. He was given a great challenge, but instead of rising to it, he made up excuses about needing mentorship. At the very least, he could've generalized the problem, and made an open source library as leverage for finding an even better job. Yes, he still might've gotten fired, but at least he'd have a tool he could call his own.

GiorgioG 10y ago
> He was given a great challenge, but instead of rising to it, he made excuses... It sounds like he worked his butt off, what more do you expect? I don't scale mountains for my employer, I do what is reasonably asked of me - and it sounds like he did just that. Sounds like a typical chaotic startup culture growing too fast for its own good, not paying attention or supporting its employees' needs.
- cocktailpeanuts 10y ago
  > It sounds like he worked his butt off, what more do you expect? And where did you learn that? From this blog post? You use awful lot of "sounds like" in your comment. "Sounds like" is not enough of certainty to criticize someone.

mattbee 10y ago

On the flip-side, never let one of your staff leave your company so unhappy they write a hit-piece. As a CEO you'll know if your company has been a less-than-great manager to a member of staff. (If don't have lots of written evidence that you've been managing them well ... you've probably been managing them badly.) This guy is pained he wasn't able to contribute as Gitlab grew. You can't always bring someone round as a company changes shape, but you can be kind & generous if you need to fire them.

e40 10y ago
On the flip-side, never let one of your staff leave your company so unhappy they write a hit-piece. In a world where everyone is reasonable, that's good advice. There are some people you can't reason with. What I'd look for here, if I were working at Gitlab (I'm not): is there a pattern? If not, then don't worry about it. If there is, then worry. I've seen bad exits that were the fault of the company, and ones that weren't.

hn_throwaway_99 10y ago

As a development manager, I agree. Even assuming everything he says is 100% true, his main goal still just feels like venting. Which is fine, but you should vent to friends, not in a public forum like this. It would make me question his maturity.

spacelizard 10y ago

>Otherwise I just have to wonder what the real motive is behind making a public statement like this. What is the motivation for blogging about anything? I am extremely disappointed that we are still stuck culturally in this situation where we can't have healthy public discourse about these things, where private businesses can get away with whatever they want and then proceed to threaten people for even trying to talk about it. Maybe it is sour grapes, so what? The emotional highs and lows are part of the package when it comes to startups, and hiding them doesn't do any good.

fred_is_fred 10y ago

There's very little gain for you to: - criticize them publicly - "give feedback directly" - whistleblowing There's a bad ending to all those cases ranging from them blowing you off as a guy who got fired to lawsuits. I've always politely declined exit interviews as they offer me zero value and while I may have complained about a company over a beer, I've not blogged about it.

nojvek 10y ago

I think this is great for the rest of the developer community getting first hand feedback like this. Why would another developer want to work for GitLab? Same with Uber.