4 ms·

If Microsoft had required Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all to provide free operating system upgrades on your PC every time there was a Mi

If Microsoft had required Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all to provide free operating system upgrades on your PC every time there was a Microsoft security hole, Windows would have been deader than dirt years ago. Google gets away with this because it is "free", so the refrain is "you can't complain if it's free". Google could go the same route Microsoft did, but it chooses not to. Phone manufacturers would be happy to have binary blob updates for free - but it would never happen. Google would have to custom-build, test, and certify every binary blob for every piece of hardware, which is an unjustifiable cost. If you want a phone with top-notch security, buy an Apple phone. They're supported longer, they fix their security bugs promptly, and they honestly have a better model for their OS anyway. (disclaimer: I hate Apple)

mrb 10y ago
"They're supported longer" In general yes, but not always. Security updates may stop as soon as 2 years after purchase: the iPhone 4S was discontinued on September 9, 2014, and the last iOS for it is 9.3.5 released on August 25, 2016.
- peterwwillis 10y ago
  The Galaxy Nexus was released at the same time as the 4S, and its last supported OS was Jelly Bean (4.3). The last update for this OS, 4.3.1, was released in October 2013. It was not supported after this. So the iPhone 4S, which you use as an example of a lack of support, was supported for three years longer than the comparable Android.
  - mrb 10y ago
    Yes the Galaxy Nexus was terrible in that respect. But it doesn't change my main point which is that: Apple security updates may stop as soon as 2 years after purchase. And the last example of this was 8 months ago when 4S support ended. By contrast the Galaxy Nexus support ended 3.5 years ago and is no longer representative of Google support's policy which is now longer.
  - shrewduser 10y ago
    the galaxy nexus was a special case where shortly after it was released TI pulled out of the SoC making business all together. no other nexus suffered the same fate as that phone. so your statement that iphone gets more support than the equivalent nexus is spurious at best.
cwyers 10y ago
> If Microsoft had required Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all to provide free operating system upgrades on your PC every time there was a Microsoft security hole, Windows would have been deader than dirt years ago. What? Double what? Microsoft doesn't require this because they don't require they have a stable driver ABI, so Microsoft can ship updates to Microsoft code without requiring that device manufacturers ship updated drivers to go with.
- zrm 10y ago
  And so we come to the root of the problem. Either Android/Linux needs a stable driver ABI, or somehow (looking at you Google) the hardware vendors have to be convinced to release driver source. Last weekend I installed the latest Debian on a Pentium II from 1997. What madness that I can't install the latest Android on a three year old phone?
  - kogepathic 10y ago
    > What madness that I can't install the latest Android on a three year old phone? Unfortunately I think this falls to Linus and the kernel developers. The ARM portions of the kernel are a fucking dumpster fire of epic proportions. Because every SoC vendor can bolt on different components, there is a truckload of one off code in the kernel to handle every variation of an SoC a vendor makes. Couple this with the fact that there are very few rules governing where and how vendors connect external devices via IO, and you have code for specific boards to ensure they work. It's simply not maintainable. Many ARM boards ship with heavily patched kernels, which while having their source code released, will never be merged into the mainline kernel because of lack of effort by the manufacturer or simply the kludgy nature of the code offending the good senses of kernel developers. Where Google can help is by preventing manufacturers from shipping a device with Android unless their kernel changes have been accepted to mainline Linux. This is the only way to ensure support for multiple years. Actually, that will only help devices which have Google Play Services. Since Android is open source Chinese manufacturers can just release their own builds based off AOSP which don't include Google Play Services and then Google has absolutely no recourse.
  - 10y ago
j_s 10y ago
I assume Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all have plenty of vulnerabilities in their homegrown drivers, many of which remain unpatched. Fortunately these are small enough market segments that they don't get much attention from the bad guys.
biafra 10y ago
Better because I have to ask for Apples permission to install applications on it?

mrb 10y ago

"They're supported longer" In general yes, but not always. Security updates may stop as soon as 2 years after purchase: the iPhone 4S was discontinued on September 9, 2014, and the last iOS for it is 9.3.5 released on August 25, 2016.

peterwwillis 10y ago
The Galaxy Nexus was released at the same time as the 4S, and its last supported OS was Jelly Bean (4.3). The last update for this OS, 4.3.1, was released in October 2013. It was not supported after this. So the iPhone 4S, which you use as an example of a lack of support, was supported for three years longer than the comparable Android.
- mrb 10y ago
  Yes the Galaxy Nexus was terrible in that respect. But it doesn't change my main point which is that: Apple security updates may stop as soon as 2 years after purchase. And the last example of this was 8 months ago when 4S support ended. By contrast the Galaxy Nexus support ended 3.5 years ago and is no longer representative of Google support's policy which is now longer.
- shrewduser 10y ago
  the galaxy nexus was a special case where shortly after it was released TI pulled out of the SoC making business all together. no other nexus suffered the same fate as that phone. so your statement that iphone gets more support than the equivalent nexus is spurious at best.

cwyers 10y ago

> If Microsoft had required Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all to provide free operating system upgrades on your PC every time there was a Microsoft security hole, Windows would have been deader than dirt years ago. What? Double what? Microsoft doesn't require this because they don't require they have a stable driver ABI, so Microsoft can ship updates to Microsoft code without requiring that device manufacturers ship updated drivers to go with.

zrm 10y ago
And so we come to the root of the problem. Either Android/Linux needs a stable driver ABI, or somehow (looking at you Google) the hardware vendors have to be convinced to release driver source. Last weekend I installed the latest Debian on a Pentium II from 1997. What madness that I can't install the latest Android on a three year old phone?
- kogepathic 10y ago
  > What madness that I can't install the latest Android on a three year old phone? Unfortunately I think this falls to Linus and the kernel developers. The ARM portions of the kernel are a fucking dumpster fire of epic proportions. Because every SoC vendor can bolt on different components, there is a truckload of one off code in the kernel to handle every variation of an SoC a vendor makes. Couple this with the fact that there are very few rules governing where and how vendors connect external devices via IO, and you have code for specific boards to ensure they work. It's simply not maintainable. Many ARM boards ship with heavily patched kernels, which while having their source code released, will never be merged into the mainline kernel because of lack of effort by the manufacturer or simply the kludgy nature of the code offending the good senses of kernel developers. Where Google can help is by preventing manufacturers from shipping a device with Android unless their kernel changes have been accepted to mainline Linux. This is the only way to ensure support for multiple years. Actually, that will only help devices which have Google Play Services. Since Android is open source Chinese manufacturers can just release their own builds based off AOSP which don't include Google Play Services and then Google has absolutely no recourse.
- 10y ago

j_s 10y ago

I assume Dell, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Toshiba, Acer, Asus, etc all have plenty of vulnerabilities in their homegrown drivers, many of which remain unpatched. Fortunately these are small enough market segments that they don't get much attention from the bad guys.

biafra 10y ago

Better because I have to ask for Apples permission to install applications on it?