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There's already a lot of suggestion that Adir (the Israeli F-35) has seen combat over Syria in January. At a minimum French intelligence [1] and Israeli media [

by nerdy 10y ago

There's already a lot of suggestion that Adir (the Israeli F-35) has seen combat over Syria in January. At a minimum French intelligence [1] and Israeli media [2] claim the attack was carried out using F-35s. They reportedly went on to perform a flyby of Assad's palace. Adir has special kit which may replace some of the problem components in the stock American version, but the air frame itself isn't a "long way" from being combat-ready. [1] http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/2017/03/07/have-israels-new-f-35s-seen-combat/ http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/2017/03/07/have-israels-new-... [2] https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/video-footage-israeli-jets-attacking-damascus/ https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/video-footage-israeli-j...

AlexCoventry 10y ago
Combat with who? Did it go up against anything which would challenge an F16?
- weego 10y ago
  Planes don't toe-to-toe with other planes anymore.
  - burnallofit 10y ago
    As it says in the article... then why does it have a gun? One of its primary purposes is air-to-air. Don't take my word for it: https://www.f35.com/about/capabilities https://www.f35.com/about/capabilities
    - cm2187 10y ago
      The gun is also for close air support, if I understand the article.
      - kodfodrasz 10y ago
        For CAS these planes are simply not good for. For that role A-10 or Super Tucano like cheaper planes are needed, because those planes are more efficient for that role.
    - gozur88 10y ago
      It has a gun because pilots don't feel comfortable without a gun. It makes no sense, but fifty years ago the USAF jumped the gun a little bit on air-to-air missiles, and whenever someone points out the gun is a stupid thing to include on a modern strike fighter people bring up this fifty year old problem. The A version of the F-35 has three seconds worth of gun ammo. It would only be two seconds, but there's some lag between the trigger pull and the gun being fully spun up.
  - AlexCoventry 10y ago
    Then what was its role? Did it do anything existing planes struggle with?
    - strictnein 10y ago
      It'll eat up the next gen fighters coming out of China and Russia. The F-16 would struggle with that. Of course, the F-22 would eat them up as well, but it's a stealth air superiority fighter while the F-35 is a stealth multi-purpose strike fighter.
      - AlexCoventry 10y ago
        That wasn't the question, though.
        strictnein 10y ago
        Thought you were more broadly asking what its role in general was. If you're asking what its role was in that specific strike: Israel doesn't have any other stealth capabilities. So its role would be to fly over troubled territory rather freely, given the capabilities in the region. The F-15s and F-16s they have can't do that.
        AlexCoventry 10y ago
        It's confusing to call that combat as a rebuttal to the flaws highlighted in this report.
        valuearb 10y ago
        The drones they have can do that far more cheaply.
      - astrodust 10y ago
        The F-35 is a great plane until it runs out of missiles.
  - astrodust 10y ago
    They do in simulations and exercises.
valuearb 10y ago
It's not believable that the Israelis would risk an expensive new plane only days into testing on missions. The only "source" is a French journalists, and numerous other experts have expressed substantial doubt about his story.
- samstave 10y ago
  The israelis are the reason the world knows about stuxnet because of their hubris and 'fuck-you' attitude. Of course is is believable that they would use the f-35 early to show how big their swinging dick can be with america as their funding bitch... so yeah... I totally believe the israelis could have done this. The other option is the US did it with the plausible deniability that israel would be blamed in order to test the f-35. I mean, if it were you, wouldnt you want to test the damn thing in an operation after all the spending and PR the plane has received. Even behind closed doors you'd want to be able to say "See! It works"
- nerdy 10y ago
  > It's not believable that the Israelis would risk an expensive new plane only days into testing on missions. Why? Is Israel paying now? http://mondoweiss.net/2016/12/israels-free-ride/ http://mondoweiss.net/2016/12/israels-free-ride/ Also worth noting that the 2nd link above says Israeli media reported it too. Are there any credible denials which suggest which aircraft was actually used? Everything I can find only says it's "unlikely" but won't go further. Who are the numerous experts? Why would they use aircraft which aren't stealthy while Russia has an ever-increasing presence in Syria?

by nerdy 10y ago

AlexCoventry 10y ago

Combat with who? Did it go up against anything which would challenge an F16?

weego 10y ago
Planes don't toe-to-toe with other planes anymore.
- burnallofit 10y ago
  As it says in the article... then why does it have a gun? One of its primary purposes is air-to-air. Don't take my word for it: https://www.f35.com/about/capabilities https://www.f35.com/about/capabilities
  - cm2187 10y ago
    The gun is also for close air support, if I understand the article.
    - kodfodrasz 10y ago
      For CAS these planes are simply not good for. For that role A-10 or Super Tucano like cheaper planes are needed, because those planes are more efficient for that role.
  - gozur88 10y ago
    It has a gun because pilots don't feel comfortable without a gun. It makes no sense, but fifty years ago the USAF jumped the gun a little bit on air-to-air missiles, and whenever someone points out the gun is a stupid thing to include on a modern strike fighter people bring up this fifty year old problem. The A version of the F-35 has three seconds worth of gun ammo. It would only be two seconds, but there's some lag between the trigger pull and the gun being fully spun up.
- AlexCoventry 10y ago
  Then what was its role? Did it do anything existing planes struggle with?
  - strictnein 10y ago
    It'll eat up the next gen fighters coming out of China and Russia. The F-16 would struggle with that. Of course, the F-22 would eat them up as well, but it's a stealth air superiority fighter while the F-35 is a stealth multi-purpose strike fighter.
    - AlexCoventry 10y ago
      That wasn't the question, though.
      - strictnein 10y ago
        Thought you were more broadly asking what its role in general was. If you're asking what its role was in that specific strike: Israel doesn't have any other stealth capabilities. So its role would be to fly over troubled territory rather freely, given the capabilities in the region. The F-15s and F-16s they have can't do that.
        AlexCoventry 10y ago
        It's confusing to call that combat as a rebuttal to the flaws highlighted in this report.
        valuearb 10y ago
        The drones they have can do that far more cheaply.
    - astrodust 10y ago
      The F-35 is a great plane until it runs out of missiles.
- astrodust 10y ago
  They do in simulations and exercises.

valuearb 10y ago

It's not believable that the Israelis would risk an expensive new plane only days into testing on missions. The only "source" is a French journalists, and numerous other experts have expressed substantial doubt about his story.

samstave 10y ago
The israelis are the reason the world knows about stuxnet because of their hubris and 'fuck-you' attitude. Of course is is believable that they would use the f-35 early to show how big their swinging dick can be with america as their funding bitch... so yeah... I totally believe the israelis could have done this. The other option is the US did it with the plausible deniability that israel would be blamed in order to test the f-35. I mean, if it were you, wouldnt you want to test the damn thing in an operation after all the spending and PR the plane has received. Even behind closed doors you'd want to be able to say "See! It works"
nerdy 10y ago
> It's not believable that the Israelis would risk an expensive new plane only days into testing on missions. Why? Is Israel paying now? http://mondoweiss.net/2016/12/israels-free-ride/ http://mondoweiss.net/2016/12/israels-free-ride/ Also worth noting that the 2nd link above says Israeli media reported it too. Are there any credible denials which suggest which aircraft was actually used? Everything I can find only says it's "unlikely" but won't go further. Who are the numerous experts? Why would they use aircraft which aren't stealthy while Russia has an ever-increasing presence in Syria?