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Is this really that different from Verizon phones having Google services enabled by default (if that's even true -- I don't use Verizon). Why is Verizon spying

by tabeth 10y ago

Is this really that different from Verizon phones having Google services enabled by default (if that's even true -- I don't use Verizon). Why is Verizon spying on you any worse, or better than Google or Facebook? No one should spy on you. Period.

Vermeulen 10y ago
By using Google's free services you agree to giving them data - that's not how customers want to use an ISP. Google is a company that relies on trust. If I can't trust them with my data their business will seriously suffer. Verizon in no way cares about users trusting them, it's not in their business model. It needs to be a choice what companies I trust with my data
- zepto 10y ago
  This is false. A lack of trust will not hurt google one bit since there is no meaningful competition for their search engine and the vast majority of their revenue comes from search ads. Edit: This may be an unpopular conclusion but it based on facts. https://www.cnet.com/news/people-trust-nsa-more-than-google-survey-says/ https://www.cnet.com/news/people-trust-nsa-more-than-google-...
- tabeth 10y ago
  It's very unlikely that Verizon's business will suffer, given their membership in the internet oligopoly [1]. Also, in regards to your other point -- what's stopping Verizon from just changing their business model? The fact Google offers free services is irrelevant. Verizon could do this and "offer" faster internet, claiming this tracking is what enables everyone to have faster internet for "free." There's a cost to everything -- including giving away your information. If there was no cost, then Google and company wouldn't want it. The fact that they're able to make money from it implies there's value, and if you're giving away value, it must be costing you. It's just not dollars. I still think you shouldn't let anyone spy on you, free or not. What Verizon is doing is just the same as them raising the price of their service, except worse, because once they have your data the returns on it will only compound. [1] http://www.verizon.com/about/news/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-terminating-access-monopoly http://www.verizon.com/about/news/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-t...
jaywunder 10y ago
The reason why I'm okay with Google, but not Verizon spying on me is because I pay Verizon but I don't pay Google. Verizon shouldn't have to sell my data for more money because they already charge money for their service. If their service is too expensive then Verizon can charge more money. However Google gives me services for free so I expect they'll sell my data to other companies.
- JustSomeNobody 10y ago
  Exactly. Your data is a currency. I cannot stress this enough. I(!) should be allowed to spend that currency however I choose. If I am already paying you for a service, you shouldn't get to have my data, too!
- criddell 10y ago
  I actually feel like I'm getting something in return for letting Google index my personal data. I also trust Google far, far more than any ISP (wired or wireless) that I have used.
  - Bartweiss 10y ago
    I also have faith that Google won't accidentally expose my data to the entire internet - or at least, they'll only fall to vulnerabilities that affect everyone. Verizon's ethics aside, I have no real trust in their competence to keep data to themselves. I've dealt with their website, I've read the stories of people getting their accounts hijacked because Verizon can't handle verification right, and all the rest. I don't want a side channel to track my downloads, location, and god knows what else because I expect it'll be compromised far faster.
    - criddell 10y ago
      That, and the telcos have a history of being very helpful to the government. I'm thinking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A. Google seems to do a better job protecting their network and defending user security.
Bartweiss 10y ago
Corporate ethics aside, this scares me because I don't trust its security. Android has vulnerabilities, but they're regularly discovered and patched. A Verizon-made side channel gathering all the same stuff? That sounds like it'll bleed data to anyone and everyone and not get patched on anything like a responsible schedule.

by tabeth 10y ago

Vermeulen 10y ago

By using Google's free services you agree to giving them data - that's not how customers want to use an ISP. Google is a company that relies on trust. If I can't trust them with my data their business will seriously suffer. Verizon in no way cares about users trusting them, it's not in their business model. It needs to be a choice what companies I trust with my data

zepto 10y ago
This is false. A lack of trust will not hurt google one bit since there is no meaningful competition for their search engine and the vast majority of their revenue comes from search ads. Edit: This may be an unpopular conclusion but it based on facts. https://www.cnet.com/news/people-trust-nsa-more-than-google-survey-says/ https://www.cnet.com/news/people-trust-nsa-more-than-google-...
tabeth 10y ago
It's very unlikely that Verizon's business will suffer, given their membership in the internet oligopoly [1]. Also, in regards to your other point -- what's stopping Verizon from just changing their business model? The fact Google offers free services is irrelevant. Verizon could do this and "offer" faster internet, claiming this tracking is what enables everyone to have faster internet for "free." There's a cost to everything -- including giving away your information. If there was no cost, then Google and company wouldn't want it. The fact that they're able to make money from it implies there's value, and if you're giving away value, it must be costing you. It's just not dollars. I still think you shouldn't let anyone spy on you, free or not. What Verizon is doing is just the same as them raising the price of their service, except worse, because once they have your data the returns on it will only compound. [1] http://www.verizon.com/about/news/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-terminating-access-monopoly http://www.verizon.com/about/news/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-t...

jaywunder 10y ago

The reason why I'm okay with Google, but not Verizon spying on me is because I pay Verizon but I don't pay Google. Verizon shouldn't have to sell my data for more money because they already charge money for their service. If their service is too expensive then Verizon can charge more money. However Google gives me services for free so I expect they'll sell my data to other companies.

JustSomeNobody 10y ago
Exactly. Your data is a currency. I cannot stress this enough. I(!) should be allowed to spend that currency however I choose. If I am already paying you for a service, you shouldn't get to have my data, too!
criddell 10y ago
I actually feel like I'm getting something in return for letting Google index my personal data. I also trust Google far, far more than any ISP (wired or wireless) that I have used.
- Bartweiss 10y ago
  I also have faith that Google won't accidentally expose my data to the entire internet - or at least, they'll only fall to vulnerabilities that affect everyone. Verizon's ethics aside, I have no real trust in their competence to keep data to themselves. I've dealt with their website, I've read the stories of people getting their accounts hijacked because Verizon can't handle verification right, and all the rest. I don't want a side channel to track my downloads, location, and god knows what else because I expect it'll be compromised far faster.
  - criddell 10y ago
    That, and the telcos have a history of being very helpful to the government. I'm thinking about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A. Google seems to do a better job protecting their network and defending user security.

Bartweiss 10y ago

Corporate ethics aside, this scares me because I don't trust its security. Android has vulnerabilities, but they're regularly discovered and patched. A Verizon-made side channel gathering all the same stuff? That sounds like it'll bleed data to anyone and everyone and not get patched on anything like a responsible schedule.