3 ms·

Microsoft wants to keep developers very busy learning _their_ terminology and development tools so that there is no time to learn any other: e.g., W3C terminolo

Microsoft wants to keep developers very busy learning _their_ terminology and development tools so that there is no time to learn any other: e.g., W3C terminology, Apache, PHP or cherry.py. What better way than to rename everything that already exists in W3C and add even more new terminology from the Microsoft's tools. Learning to use Microsoft's tools with any degree of skill means that you simply won't have time or memory to learn much else. Most developers won't have sufficient time to learn even learn Microsoft's tools! The result: a brain full of cryptic terminology that no one understands except another unfortunate who made the same mistake. And when Microsoft releases the "next generation", everything you know will instantly be labelled as obsolete, inefficient and bug-ridden by Microsoft. Not exactly a "career path." Any developer considering studying .NET (or any other technology) should ask himself: In the long run what is the most profitable action that I can do next? I venture that the answer is rarely "learn .NET". Even if the boss just ordered you to learn .NET, the answer to the above question is more likely "Send out my resume."

maximilian 19y ago
But its not that bad. You just use it and when you run into a problem you look it up. Thats what API docs are for. The same holds for java. Most programmers aren't going to be using the whole library, just a little of it. And autocomplete in visual studio does a lot of that thinking for you. You'll use a hundred different methods without thinking about it quicker than you'll know. I threw together a program that read and wrote from the serial port and did a bunch of stuff in like 1 day. Between googling for examples and a tiny bit of help from a friend who programs c# it was very straightforward.
brentr 19y ago
This is the exact reason why I don't use C# anymore.
nkohari 19y ago
Nothing personal, but this is the biggest load of crap I've read for awhile. It's just complete and total FUD. Personal preferences aside, .NET is no different than any Java, Ruby/Rails, or any other programming stack. Programmers typically gravitate towards one stack or the other based on experience. Microsoft doesn't have any sort of "evil plan" to fill your mind with .NET. As for choosing a career path, while .NET isn't the trendiest stack, there are definitely plenty of jobs to be had, just like with Java. It's true that if you're interested in working for a startup, you might want to learn Python or Ruby, but if you're interested in job security (which is what you're talking about), you better stick with the "enterprisey" stacks like .NET or Java. I'm a .NET developer, but I'm not a huge fan of Microsoft. Still, I can't stand it when people claim that everything Microsoft does is some sort of evil plan. No one is claiming that 37signals is trying to take over the world because they promote the use of Rails.
sgoraya 19y ago
Typical response, IMO - A lot of professional developers use .NET and Visual Studio, create great apps and make good money - I've worked in the videogame industry and now at a web startup. In both instances, we have used MS development tools to varying degrees. At the game studio, we primarily used visual studio - We preferred visual studio for a lot of reasons which I dont feel like enumerating in quick post; Developing for cross platforms, VS was the best choice and supported by all first party vendors (SONY, MS, NOA). Although it might be the trendy thing to bash MS, their developer tools and support are very good - Yes, .NET libraries and API's are certainly bloated in certain areas, if so, hack it to your liking and create a smaller footprint - .NET is very flexible and is really not that hard to learn; You make it sound like learning MS technologies and other development tools/languages are mutually exclusive, when in reality anyone who has coded .NET knows that to be untrue If you are asked to learn .NET in a professional environment and your response is 'Send out my resume', I'm not so sure I would like to have you on my development team. (goes both ways I suppose, if you dislike .net so much, you should find an environment/job where you can develop to your preference) Seems like I'm a shill for MS ;) I'm not, I just think they deserve a bit more credit than they are given - in my current job we develop in a mixed mode environment with MS & LAMP (might sound weird, but it works) My 2-cents

maximilian 19y ago

But its not that bad. You just use it and when you run into a problem you look it up. Thats what API docs are for. The same holds for java. Most programmers aren't going to be using the whole library, just a little of it. And autocomplete in visual studio does a lot of that thinking for you. You'll use a hundred different methods without thinking about it quicker than you'll know. I threw together a program that read and wrote from the serial port and did a bunch of stuff in like 1 day. Between googling for examples and a tiny bit of help from a friend who programs c# it was very straightforward.

brentr 19y ago

This is the exact reason why I don't use C# anymore.

nkohari 19y ago

Nothing personal, but this is the biggest load of crap I've read for awhile. It's just complete and total FUD. Personal preferences aside, .NET is no different than any Java, Ruby/Rails, or any other programming stack. Programmers typically gravitate towards one stack or the other based on experience. Microsoft doesn't have any sort of "evil plan" to fill your mind with .NET. As for choosing a career path, while .NET isn't the trendiest stack, there are definitely plenty of jobs to be had, just like with Java. It's true that if you're interested in working for a startup, you might want to learn Python or Ruby, but if you're interested in job security (which is what you're talking about), you better stick with the "enterprisey" stacks like .NET or Java. I'm a .NET developer, but I'm not a huge fan of Microsoft. Still, I can't stand it when people claim that everything Microsoft does is some sort of evil plan. No one is claiming that 37signals is trying to take over the world because they promote the use of Rails.

sgoraya 19y ago

Typical response, IMO - A lot of professional developers use .NET and Visual Studio, create great apps and make good money - I've worked in the videogame industry and now at a web startup. In both instances, we have used MS development tools to varying degrees. At the game studio, we primarily used visual studio - We preferred visual studio for a lot of reasons which I dont feel like enumerating in quick post; Developing for cross platforms, VS was the best choice and supported by all first party vendors (SONY, MS, NOA). Although it might be the trendy thing to bash MS, their developer tools and support are very good - Yes, .NET libraries and API's are certainly bloated in certain areas, if so, hack it to your liking and create a smaller footprint - .NET is very flexible and is really not that hard to learn; You make it sound like learning MS technologies and other development tools/languages are mutually exclusive, when in reality anyone who has coded .NET knows that to be untrue If you are asked to learn .NET in a professional environment and your response is 'Send out my resume', I'm not so sure I would like to have you on my development team. (goes both ways I suppose, if you dislike .net so much, you should find an environment/job where you can develop to your preference) Seems like I'm a shill for MS ;) I'm not, I just think they deserve a bit more credit than they are given - in my current job we develop in a mixed mode environment with MS & LAMP (might sound weird, but it works) My 2-cents