5 ms·

It was literally founded on those things, in the sense that the original inhabitants were about 50% indentured and they built the damned place. Saying that the

by M_Grey 10y ago

It was literally founded on those things, in the sense that the original inhabitants were about 50% indentured and they built the damned place. Saying that the US wasn't founded on these realities is like saying the AU wasn't founded as a prison colony.

narrowrail 10y ago
As someone who is part Cherokee (on the Dawes' Rolls), what do you mean by 'original inhabitants'?
- M_Grey 10y ago
  In context, what do you think? Did your people found the US, or practice indentured servitude and slavery? As I understand it you were part of a very different and much older nation that predated the current one. Again, as I understand the people I'm describing came by and decided to take it from you, founding a new one its place. I'm not endorsing that, and my ancestry is utterly unrelated to either group's history.
  - talmand 10y ago
    Some Native Americans did, in fact, have and sold slaves.
talmand 10y ago
So, by your logic, anything happening during a country's founding we deem today as bad means that country was founded on those bad things. Then every single country on Earth in all of human history was founded on bad things. That's silly logic.
- M_Grey 10y ago
  No, that isn't my logic and isn't what I said. In the case of the US it's been a continuous legacy that began with indentured servitude and slavery, continued through slavery and sharecropping, and now exists today in various forms including in prisons. If you can't or won't argue the points I'm actually making, don't try to inject your own version of what you think I might be saying.
  - talmand 10y ago
    Well, it is your logic, you should own it. I am arguing the points you are making, I disagree with your claim that bad things happening during the formation of a country is the basis of that country. You are the one using generalized statements to label an entire nation of people as evil. If you want to say some, I repeat some, of the founders had unfortunate attitudes toward slavery then that's fine. Some of them did, some of them did not. But you are heavily insinuating that everyone, EVERYONE, at the time of the formation of the country was in favor of indentured servitude and slavery. Which is simply not true. I would assume the indentured servants and slaves who later became citizens would not be in agreement with such things. Although, I'm willing to bet we could find examples of ones that were. Did those individual points happen in the US throughout its history? Yes they did, I have no problem agreeing to that. But since you seem to suggest that the US is a bad country due to that history then by standard logic we must dictate that every other country that have had similar bad things in its history must equally be bad. Which is quite likely every single country this planet has ever had throughout human history. You are choosing to ignore the good to point out the bad and then blame everyone for it, whether they are responsible or not. That is silly logic. Just because a country has bad moments in its history does not mean that is the basis and fabric of that country.

by M_Grey 10y ago

narrowrail 10y ago

As someone who is part Cherokee (on the Dawes' Rolls), what do you mean by 'original inhabitants'?

M_Grey 10y ago
In context, what do you think? Did your people found the US, or practice indentured servitude and slavery? As I understand it you were part of a very different and much older nation that predated the current one. Again, as I understand the people I'm describing came by and decided to take it from you, founding a new one its place. I'm not endorsing that, and my ancestry is utterly unrelated to either group's history.
- talmand 10y ago
  Some Native Americans did, in fact, have and sold slaves.

talmand 10y ago

So, by your logic, anything happening during a country's founding we deem today as bad means that country was founded on those bad things. Then every single country on Earth in all of human history was founded on bad things. That's silly logic.

M_Grey 10y ago
No, that isn't my logic and isn't what I said. In the case of the US it's been a continuous legacy that began with indentured servitude and slavery, continued through slavery and sharecropping, and now exists today in various forms including in prisons. If you can't or won't argue the points I'm actually making, don't try to inject your own version of what you think I might be saying.
- talmand 10y ago
  Well, it is your logic, you should own it. I am arguing the points you are making, I disagree with your claim that bad things happening during the formation of a country is the basis of that country. You are the one using generalized statements to label an entire nation of people as evil. If you want to say some, I repeat some, of the founders had unfortunate attitudes toward slavery then that's fine. Some of them did, some of them did not. But you are heavily insinuating that everyone, EVERYONE, at the time of the formation of the country was in favor of indentured servitude and slavery. Which is simply not true. I would assume the indentured servants and slaves who later became citizens would not be in agreement with such things. Although, I'm willing to bet we could find examples of ones that were. Did those individual points happen in the US throughout its history? Yes they did, I have no problem agreeing to that. But since you seem to suggest that the US is a bad country due to that history then by standard logic we must dictate that every other country that have had similar bad things in its history must equally be bad. Which is quite likely every single country this planet has ever had throughout human history. You are choosing to ignore the good to point out the bad and then blame everyone for it, whether they are responsible or not. That is silly logic. Just because a country has bad moments in its history does not mean that is the basis and fabric of that country.