21 ms·

Apple: Make a desktop, your iPad app is toast

71 points by ukdm 16y ago

ukdm 16y ago
I can't help but wonder why this keeps happening. Rejecting this app seems a bit ludicrous to me. But I have to wonder if this has anything to do with Steve Jobs and Apple policies, or just some of the people who work at Apple enforcing the "Apple-way". There are quite a few Apple fanatics out there. The ones who say Apple can do no wrong and the Apple way is the right way. They would do most things to make Steve Jobs happy. So it's not a giant leap to think some of those people have made it on to Apple's payroll and possibly hold senior positions at Apple. So is this a case of Apple being a bit ridiculous with its policies, or people within Apple following the Apple-way and policies a little too closely? This might just be a staffing problem.
- leviathant 16y ago
  The developers sent an email to Steve Jobs about the removal of the app, and he replied "We are not allowing apps that create their own desktops. Sorry." If you think that's a staffing problem, the problem staff is Jobs.
  - ukdm 16y ago
    True. But do you think Jobs took the time to look into this, or just read the review comments from review process?
    - michael_dorfman 16y ago
      Does it matter? Either way, the result is the same. If he's not setting the policy, he's explicitly supporting it.
      - stcredzero 16y ago
        Seems like he's supporting idiots who don't think things through. Why not approve this app and warn him he's getting awfully desktop-ish?
    - pavlov 16y ago
      This is starting to sound like some kind of monarchist apology -- "the King always makes the best possible decision, but sometimes his flawed underlings provide him with bad reports".
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
martythemaniak 16y ago
Someone suggested that the reason they banned it is because they are preparing their own widgety release, but have a look at the app: http://www.groundhog.com.au/myframe/ http://www.groundhog.com.au/myframe/ I think its as simple as someone at Apple seeing that and thinking "I don't want our iPad to be used like a picture frame". And if Apple doesn't like how you use their product in your house, they'll do something about it.
- glhaynes 16y ago
  Apple puts a button for 'picture frame mode' right on the lock screen of the iPad. So, no, it's not because they're offended that people might use it as a picture frame.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
tvon 16y ago
It seems to me that a widget app, if popular, would become a new target for 3rd party applications, and I can't see why Apple would want that.
- stcredzero 16y ago
  Doesn't seem like a widget app to me. More like a picture frame with lots of features. Where is there a 3rd party widget feature?
  - tvon 16y ago
    True, I thought it had features similar to the Dashboard app, but apparently not.
JoeAltmaier 16y ago
I don't see how I can responsibly spend effort on developing an iPad app. The "approval" process is chaotic and arbitrary - witness intelligent cooperative people having their whole business shot down seemingly at random. I will develop for other platforms - the market leader Android for instance - which operate on the oldfashioned principle of "free market".
- pavlov 16y ago
  Technically, Symbian is still the market leader by a comfortable margin. (The development options are fairly confusing though. For C/C++ development, the only Symbian dev avenue worth considering nowadays is "Nokia Qt SDK", which is surprisingly nice. Java seems to be essentially deprecated, but higher-level options like Python and JavaScript through Web Runtime are available.)
  - blub 16y ago
    Buying Qt was a brilliant move by Nokia. Qt fans like myself have naturally drifted toward Nokia phone development. Google should support this guy: http://groups.google.com/group/android-ndk/browse_thread/thread/5642bcc68746dab1 http://groups.google.com/group/android-ndk/browse_thread/thr... and be more open with development options in general. Official support for Mono or Qt would attract a lot of interest.
  - somebear 16y ago
    The preferred development avenues for Nokia smartphones (Symbian & Maemo/Meego) is either the Qt SDK [http://www.forum.nokia.com/Tools_Docs_and_Code/Tools/IDEs/Nokia_Qt_SDK/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Tools_Docs_and_Code/Tools/IDEs/No...] or WRT (Web RunTime) [http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Web_Technologies/Web_Runtime/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Web_Technologie...]. I agree that Qt is "surprisingly nice". Personally, I enjoy the iPhone UIKit framework, but the Qt SDK is almost as good (and in some areas better). I don't have much experience with the WRT, but in the N8 the demos I have seen are quite impressive performance-wise. [disclaimer: I work for Nokia, take all I say (on this matter) with a grain of salt.] Edit: Minor spelling.
- 16y ago
blhack 16y ago
Does apple not see how this will end up badly for them? Apple, you're scaring off talented developers; soon the only people who will be left are people who can afford to have gobs and gobs of apps rejected.
- stcredzero 16y ago
  Mindshare is The foundation. Apple squanders it. Google gets this part right.
  - steveklabnik 16y ago
    There are lots of complaints about how Android version incompatibilities makes it a pain for developers. The iPhone is a joy to program for, but the app store policy sucks. Android is a bitch to program for, but the app story policy is great. I'd say they're about neck and neck.
    - stcredzero 16y ago
      iPhone - Has greed on it's side, good environment, not too open, squanders mindshare Android - Not the 1st choice of the greedy, too many compatibility issues, very open, makes the right moves for mindshare. By this analysis, Android seems to be on a winning trajectory in the long run.
      - ThomPete 16y ago
        That surely depends on how you define winning. Apple actually makes money with their mobile products. Not sure do or will do.
    - acangiano 16y ago
      > Android is a bitch to program for, but the app story policy is great. The Android Market policy is only great if you are from one of the few countries that can publish app on it. It amazes me that this aspect is always left out while discussing the topic.
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
RyanMcGreal 16y ago
Perhaps Apple has been taken over by foreign insurgents following the Simple Sabotage Field Manual.
- hga 16y ago
  Nah, I think the iJuche explanation/analogy is best: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/ipad-isolationism/12031 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/ipad-isolationism/12031 Note WRT to the self-reliance theme of Juche that the above was written before the section 3.3.1 change. "Spirit of self-reliance" indeed.
jrockway 16y ago
What’s next, Apple kills off birds which live on its campus that wet their nests? Yeah, that sounds like the logical next step... ...?
- BrandonM 16y ago
  Did you actually read the Monty Python reference farther down the page that explained that metaphor?
  - jrockway 16y ago
    Nope. Bad writing, boring story.
Batsu 16y ago
Quite frankly, I'm not even surprised anymore. Every month a developer uncovers a new piece of the mysterious approval puzzle.
- k_shehadeh 16y ago
  Right. For me, it's not that they're instituting restrictive policies (which I can sort of understand in some cases). The problem is that it seems to be a moving target. If I was an iPhone developer I would feel like I was being toyed with.
pstevensza 16y ago
Some viable arguments lost in a tirade of hysteria. I've never written an app for the iPhone/iPad, so I have no first hand experience with the approval/rejection nonsense. I do however own an iPhone, and I love the fact that I can expect a certain level of quality in the applications I buy. One thing that makes me snicker about the article in question is the purpose of the app. Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? With Twitter overlays? Anyway, each to their own. My main point is that so long as the people bitching publicly are gibbering loons like the idiot-in-charge at the linked blog, very few folk will pay attention.
- mcav 16y ago
  > Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? With Twitter overlays? When you're at your laptop/desktop computer on your desk. It's handy to have a dedicated display for twitter/other dashboards, if you like keeping up on that stuff while you work.
- DeusExMachina 16y ago
  Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? Why the hell would you want to use an iPhone to make farts? But the app store is full of them. I, as an iPhone developer (reconsidering the thing every time I read news like this one) don't see all that quality in the app store. Sure, there are a lot of high quality apps, but there is a lot of garbage that just piles up hiding worthy applications.
  - gte910h 16y ago
    And the iPad appstore app is hideous for browsing, so you have to wade through all the crappy apps to see anything, and whenever you look at an app, you get put back to the beginning of the category.
- iron_ball 16y ago
  What does your opinion of this app have to do with the app store approval process? How does rejecting this app help Apple ensure overall quality?
korch 16y ago
Apple hypocrisy at it's finest! So it's okay to make VNC, Citrix and other kinds of apps that can connect you to remote Windows and Linux desktops, but any app that looks too different from or too similar to Apple's Springboard faces automatic bannination? At this rate, Apple is going to need to start employing teams of Theologians and Talmudic scholars to interpret and administer the Kafkaesque Laws of the App Store. Never mind the fact that Apple, nor any software company should ever be in the position of censoring the content of any software that runs on their machines. What did Steve say on the D8 video yesterday—"companies don't have to be rude to other companies" That's the Apple we want, not the Sith Inquisition. Big corporations bend the rules all the time to help other big corporations—everyone knows and accepts this. But when big corporations make the rules secret, and then use them to help each other while hurting the little guy, well, that's just as rude and arrogant as it gets from a company!
- jodrellblank 16y ago
  Never mind the fact that Apple, nor any software company should ever be in the position of censoring the content of any software that runs on their machines. In what sense is this "a fact"?
Maro 16y ago
I've already decided I'm waiting for the Android hardware/software platform to stabilize before buying a smartphone, due to Apple's policies, but I was really looking forward to buying an iPad this summer. Yes, the policies are the same, but it's got no reasonable alternative and it looks so sexy and useful. However, reading this article outraged me so much I changed my mind. As a developer I don't want other developers to have to put up with Apple's 1984 policies, so I'll wait for an Android based device on the tablet front too.
bsaunder 16y ago
It's beginning to seem like Apple is treating all their third party developers as employees that they don't have to directly compensate.
ra88it 16y ago
The picture of the app on the dev's website doesn't look like a 'desktop'. Surely there is some other component in the UI that does resemble a desktop. Anybody have a link to a better screenshot?
- ra88it 16y ago
  Hmmmmm. Or maybe Apple thinks it resembles a desktop simply because there are UI components on top of a background image?

71 points by ukdm 16y ago

ukdm 16y ago

I can't help but wonder why this keeps happening. Rejecting this app seems a bit ludicrous to me. But I have to wonder if this has anything to do with Steve Jobs and Apple policies, or just some of the people who work at Apple enforcing the "Apple-way". There are quite a few Apple fanatics out there. The ones who say Apple can do no wrong and the Apple way is the right way. They would do most things to make Steve Jobs happy. So it's not a giant leap to think some of those people have made it on to Apple's payroll and possibly hold senior positions at Apple. So is this a case of Apple being a bit ridiculous with its policies, or people within Apple following the Apple-way and policies a little too closely? This might just be a staffing problem.

leviathant 16y ago
The developers sent an email to Steve Jobs about the removal of the app, and he replied "We are not allowing apps that create their own desktops. Sorry." If you think that's a staffing problem, the problem staff is Jobs.
- ukdm 16y ago
  True. But do you think Jobs took the time to look into this, or just read the review comments from review process?
  - michael_dorfman 16y ago
    Does it matter? Either way, the result is the same. If he's not setting the policy, he's explicitly supporting it.
    - stcredzero 16y ago
      Seems like he's supporting idiots who don't think things through. Why not approve this app and warn him he's getting awfully desktop-ish?
  - pavlov 16y ago
    This is starting to sound like some kind of monarchist apology -- "the King always makes the best possible decision, but sometimes his flawed underlings provide him with bad reports".
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]

martythemaniak 16y ago

Someone suggested that the reason they banned it is because they are preparing their own widgety release, but have a look at the app: http://www.groundhog.com.au/myframe/ http://www.groundhog.com.au/myframe/ I think its as simple as someone at Apple seeing that and thinking "I don't want our iPad to be used like a picture frame". And if Apple doesn't like how you use their product in your house, they'll do something about it.

glhaynes 16y ago
Apple puts a button for 'picture frame mode' right on the lock screen of the iPad. So, no, it's not because they're offended that people might use it as a picture frame.
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]

tvon 16y ago

It seems to me that a widget app, if popular, would become a new target for 3rd party applications, and I can't see why Apple would want that.

stcredzero 16y ago
Doesn't seem like a widget app to me. More like a picture frame with lots of features. Where is there a 3rd party widget feature?
- tvon 16y ago
  True, I thought it had features similar to the Dashboard app, but apparently not.

JoeAltmaier 16y ago

I don't see how I can responsibly spend effort on developing an iPad app. The "approval" process is chaotic and arbitrary - witness intelligent cooperative people having their whole business shot down seemingly at random. I will develop for other platforms - the market leader Android for instance - which operate on the oldfashioned principle of "free market".

pavlov 16y ago
Technically, Symbian is still the market leader by a comfortable margin. (The development options are fairly confusing though. For C/C++ development, the only Symbian dev avenue worth considering nowadays is "Nokia Qt SDK", which is surprisingly nice. Java seems to be essentially deprecated, but higher-level options like Python and JavaScript through Web Runtime are available.)
- blub 16y ago
  Buying Qt was a brilliant move by Nokia. Qt fans like myself have naturally drifted toward Nokia phone development. Google should support this guy: http://groups.google.com/group/android-ndk/browse_thread/thread/5642bcc68746dab1 http://groups.google.com/group/android-ndk/browse_thread/thr... and be more open with development options in general. Official support for Mono or Qt would attract a lot of interest.
- somebear 16y ago
  The preferred development avenues for Nokia smartphones (Symbian & Maemo/Meego) is either the Qt SDK [http://www.forum.nokia.com/Tools_Docs_and_Code/Tools/IDEs/Nokia_Qt_SDK/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Tools_Docs_and_Code/Tools/IDEs/No...] or WRT (Web RunTime) [http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Web_Technologies/Web_Runtime/ http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Web_Technologie...]. I agree that Qt is "surprisingly nice". Personally, I enjoy the iPhone UIKit framework, but the Qt SDK is almost as good (and in some areas better). I don't have much experience with the WRT, but in the N8 the demos I have seen are quite impressive performance-wise. [disclaimer: I work for Nokia, take all I say (on this matter) with a grain of salt.] Edit: Minor spelling.
16y ago

blhack 16y ago

Does apple not see how this will end up badly for them? Apple, you're scaring off talented developers; soon the only people who will be left are people who can afford to have gobs and gobs of apps rejected.

stcredzero 16y ago
Mindshare is The foundation. Apple squanders it. Google gets this part right.
- steveklabnik 16y ago
  There are lots of complaints about how Android version incompatibilities makes it a pain for developers. The iPhone is a joy to program for, but the app store policy sucks. Android is a bitch to program for, but the app story policy is great. I'd say they're about neck and neck.
  - stcredzero 16y ago
    iPhone - Has greed on it's side, good environment, not too open, squanders mindshare Android - Not the 1st choice of the greedy, too many compatibility issues, very open, makes the right moves for mindshare. By this analysis, Android seems to be on a winning trajectory in the long run.
    - ThomPete 16y ago
      That surely depends on how you define winning. Apple actually makes money with their mobile products. Not sure do or will do.
  - acangiano 16y ago
    > Android is a bitch to program for, but the app story policy is great. The Android Market policy is only great if you are from one of the few countries that can publish app on it. It amazes me that this aspect is always left out while discussing the topic.

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

RyanMcGreal 16y ago

Perhaps Apple has been taken over by foreign insurgents following the Simple Sabotage Field Manual.

hga 16y ago
Nah, I think the iJuche explanation/analogy is best: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/ipad-isolationism/12031 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/ipad-isolationism/12031 Note WRT to the self-reliance theme of Juche that the above was written before the section 3.3.1 change. "Spirit of self-reliance" indeed.

jrockway 16y ago

What’s next, Apple kills off birds which live on its campus that wet their nests? Yeah, that sounds like the logical next step... ...?

BrandonM 16y ago
Did you actually read the Monty Python reference farther down the page that explained that metaphor?
- jrockway 16y ago
  Nope. Bad writing, boring story.

Batsu 16y ago

Quite frankly, I'm not even surprised anymore. Every month a developer uncovers a new piece of the mysterious approval puzzle.

k_shehadeh 16y ago
Right. For me, it's not that they're instituting restrictive policies (which I can sort of understand in some cases). The problem is that it seems to be a moving target. If I was an iPhone developer I would feel like I was being toyed with.

pstevensza 16y ago

Some viable arguments lost in a tirade of hysteria. I've never written an app for the iPhone/iPad, so I have no first hand experience with the approval/rejection nonsense. I do however own an iPhone, and I love the fact that I can expect a certain level of quality in the applications I buy. One thing that makes me snicker about the article in question is the purpose of the app. Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? With Twitter overlays? Anyway, each to their own. My main point is that so long as the people bitching publicly are gibbering loons like the idiot-in-charge at the linked blog, very few folk will pay attention.

mcav 16y ago
> Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? With Twitter overlays? When you're at your laptop/desktop computer on your desk. It's handy to have a dedicated display for twitter/other dashboards, if you like keeping up on that stuff while you work.
DeusExMachina 16y ago
Why the hell would you want to waste an iPad on using it as a picture frame? Why the hell would you want to use an iPhone to make farts? But the app store is full of them. I, as an iPhone developer (reconsidering the thing every time I read news like this one) don't see all that quality in the app store. Sure, there are a lot of high quality apps, but there is a lot of garbage that just piles up hiding worthy applications.
- gte910h 16y ago
  And the iPad appstore app is hideous for browsing, so you have to wade through all the crappy apps to see anything, and whenever you look at an app, you get put back to the beginning of the category.
iron_ball 16y ago
What does your opinion of this app have to do with the app store approval process? How does rejecting this app help Apple ensure overall quality?

korch 16y ago

Apple hypocrisy at it's finest! So it's okay to make VNC, Citrix and other kinds of apps that can connect you to remote Windows and Linux desktops, but any app that looks too different from or too similar to Apple's Springboard faces automatic bannination? At this rate, Apple is going to need to start employing teams of Theologians and Talmudic scholars to interpret and administer the Kafkaesque Laws of the App Store. Never mind the fact that Apple, nor any software company should ever be in the position of censoring the content of any software that runs on their machines. What did Steve say on the D8 video yesterday—"companies don't have to be rude to other companies" That's the Apple we want, not the Sith Inquisition. Big corporations bend the rules all the time to help other big corporations—everyone knows and accepts this. But when big corporations make the rules secret, and then use them to help each other while hurting the little guy, well, that's just as rude and arrogant as it gets from a company!

jodrellblank 16y ago
Never mind the fact that Apple, nor any software company should ever be in the position of censoring the content of any software that runs on their machines. In what sense is this "a fact"?

Maro 16y ago

I've already decided I'm waiting for the Android hardware/software platform to stabilize before buying a smartphone, due to Apple's policies, but I was really looking forward to buying an iPad this summer. Yes, the policies are the same, but it's got no reasonable alternative and it looks so sexy and useful. However, reading this article outraged me so much I changed my mind. As a developer I don't want other developers to have to put up with Apple's 1984 policies, so I'll wait for an Android based device on the tablet front too.

bsaunder 16y ago

It's beginning to seem like Apple is treating all their third party developers as employees that they don't have to directly compensate.

ra88it 16y ago

The picture of the app on the dev's website doesn't look like a 'desktop'. Surely there is some other component in the UI that does resemble a desktop. Anybody have a link to a better screenshot?

ra88it 16y ago
Hmmmmm. Or maybe Apple thinks it resembles a desktop simply because there are UI components on top of a background image?