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Here's the thing: Sometimes there are people who are exceptionally talented in a given field, yet suffer from a serious illness or disability. The symptoms can

Here's the thing: Sometimes there are people who are exceptionally talented in a given field, yet suffer from a serious illness or disability. The symptoms can be apparent in their physique (such as Stephen Hawking), or in their mind (such as Terry Davis). I can understand why people who do not have direct experience with mental illness might have trouble separating the symptoms from the person, but I would encourage those who criticise Terry for the highly unfortunate way his illness manifests itself to try to find compassion for the man, not ridicule. I'm willing to bet pretty good money that less than 1% of people on HN, and the software development industry in general, could achieve the technical feats on the level of what Terry has done. In fact it's probably considerably fewer than that. Here's a guy who's built an entire platform from scratch, including kernel, development tools, user interface, and applications. While there are obvious flaws (such as the visual appearance and lack of memory protection), some of the other design decisions like presentation of documentation and the way different parts of the system integrate with each other put mainstream operating systems to shame. We should be emphasising Terry's technical work, not the symptoms of his debilitating illness.

dvt 10y ago
I've always felt sad that Terry A. Davis doesn't seem to have a very strong support system (family, friends, children, etc.). There are other brilliant people that have been diagnosed with similar illnesses (Daniel Johnston[0] comes to mind) that were able to retain their public dignity while still doing fantastic work. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston
- brudgers 10y ago
  With dignity is a way of treating people. Whether I do so or not says something about me, not the other person.
  - dvt 10y ago
    That's not right. Dignity is "the state or quality of being worthy of honor or respect". Someone has (or doesn't have) dignity irrespective of how they are treated.
    - brudgers 10y ago
      People deserve to be treated with dignity regardless. Not doing so says something about me.
      - dvt 10y ago
        I think it's trivially obvious that some people do not deserve to be treated with dignity (e.g. child molesters, mass murderers, etc.). The fact that you treat them with dignity in spite of that is obviously virtuous, but they don't deserve it. As opposed to people that do: Gandhi, Jesus, MLK, and so on.
        hackuser 10y ago
        > it's trivially obvious that some people do not deserve to be treated with dignity I don't agree, and I know many people who also would disagree. Another point of view is that perhaps some people don't deserve dignity, but I'm not knowledgeable enough to know which ones and only an omniscient supernatural being would know enough to make that judgment. For me, this is the most memorable statement that concept; probably not the best, but it's where I first grasped it:[0] Frodo: It's a pity Bilbo didn't kill him when he had the chance. Gandalf: Pity? It was pity that stayed Bilbo's hand. Many that live deserve death. Some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them, Frodo? Do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. Even the very wise cannot see all ends. Also, I don't know of anyone who should throw stones. I hope I'm treated with dignity when I make mistakes; certainly nothing is gained when I'm not. [0] There are at least a couple variations I found in a quick search; don't take this one as authoritative.
        brudgers 10y ago
        What a person thinks says something about that person not about the reference objects of their thoughts.
- adrianratnapala 10y ago
  Are you saying that Terry's dignity has been diminished because there is no one around him that censors him?
knodi123 10y ago
> I can understand why people who do not have direct experience with mental illness might have trouble separating the symptoms from the person I don't judge mania, or schizophrenia. But at what point do you stop trying to separate "the person" from the things they believe and say? He's a schizophrenic, and I can't hold that against him. But a racist, homophobic, antisemitic schizophrenic is just an asshole with a regrettable mental illness. A quote from the "poor misunderstood" genius: The IRA beat Sherlock Holmes with the grace of God. Ghandi was a faggot. God said boys should be taught military things. Reputation is worth more than gold. Niggers have a reputation -- no fathers. Irish have a reputation. Germans have a reputation. Attacker has the advantage. Jews have a reputation. God said the French once stood for character. (Code of Chivalry) Ironic. I guess Jews did, too. Woah! God is boss. Too bad the Jews were cowards and didn't assassinate NAZI's.
- brudgers 10y ago
  The Hacker News community deals with those behaviors the same way it deals with them when exhibited by other members of the community. Likewise, Davis' work is recognized as intellectually interesting just like other intellectually interesting work.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- openasocket 10y ago
  What you quoted is a textbook example of "word salad," a symptom of schizophrenia. Look at it, it's not even close to coherent. Racist delusions are not exactly unheard of in paranoid schizophrenia. Unless we have information about what Terry was like before he developed schizophrenia, it's impossible to tell if this apparent racism is him or the disease. Honestly, I'm inclined to think it's the disease. I've seen him write coherent things and I've seen him write incoherent things, but I haven't seen any instance of him talking coherently in a racist manner.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]

dvt 10y ago

I've always felt sad that Terry A. Davis doesn't seem to have a very strong support system (family, friends, children, etc.). There are other brilliant people that have been diagnosed with similar illnesses (Daniel Johnston[0] comes to mind) that were able to retain their public dignity while still doing fantastic work. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Johnston

brudgers 10y ago
With dignity is a way of treating people. Whether I do so or not says something about me, not the other person.
- dvt 10y ago
  That's not right. Dignity is "the state or quality of being worthy of honor or respect". Someone has (or doesn't have) dignity irrespective of how they are treated.
  - brudgers 10y ago
    People deserve to be treated with dignity regardless. Not doing so says something about me.
    - dvt 10y ago
      I think it's trivially obvious that some people do not deserve to be treated with dignity (e.g. child molesters, mass murderers, etc.). The fact that you treat them with dignity in spite of that is obviously virtuous, but they don't deserve it. As opposed to people that do: Gandhi, Jesus, MLK, and so on.
      - hackuser 10y ago
        > it's trivially obvious that some people do not deserve to be treated with dignity I don't agree, and I know many people who also would disagree. Another point of view is that perhaps some people don't deserve dignity, but I'm not knowledgeable enough to know which ones and only an omniscient supernatural being would know enough to make that judgment. For me, this is the most memorable statement that concept; probably not the best, but it's where I first grasped it:[0] Frodo: It's a pity Bilbo didn't kill him when he had the chance. Gandalf: Pity? It was pity that stayed Bilbo's hand. Many that live deserve death. Some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them, Frodo? Do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. Even the very wise cannot see all ends. Also, I don't know of anyone who should throw stones. I hope I'm treated with dignity when I make mistakes; certainly nothing is gained when I'm not. [0] There are at least a couple variations I found in a quick search; don't take this one as authoritative.
      - brudgers 10y ago
        What a person thinks says something about that person not about the reference objects of their thoughts.
adrianratnapala 10y ago
Are you saying that Terry's dignity has been diminished because there is no one around him that censors him?

knodi123 10y ago

> I can understand why people who do not have direct experience with mental illness might have trouble separating the symptoms from the person I don't judge mania, or schizophrenia. But at what point do you stop trying to separate "the person" from the things they believe and say? He's a schizophrenic, and I can't hold that against him. But a racist, homophobic, antisemitic schizophrenic is just an asshole with a regrettable mental illness. A quote from the "poor misunderstood" genius: The IRA beat Sherlock Holmes with the grace of God. Ghandi was a faggot. God said boys should be taught military things. Reputation is worth more than gold. Niggers have a reputation -- no fathers. Irish have a reputation. Germans have a reputation. Attacker has the advantage. Jews have a reputation. God said the French once stood for character. (Code of Chivalry) Ironic. I guess Jews did, too. Woah! God is boss. Too bad the Jews were cowards and didn't assassinate NAZI's.

brudgers 10y ago
The Hacker News community deals with those behaviors the same way it deals with them when exhibited by other members of the community. Likewise, Davis' work is recognized as intellectually interesting just like other intellectually interesting work.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
openasocket 10y ago
What you quoted is a textbook example of "word salad," a symptom of schizophrenia. Look at it, it's not even close to coherent. Racist delusions are not exactly unheard of in paranoid schizophrenia. Unless we have information about what Terry was like before he developed schizophrenia, it's impossible to tell if this apparent racism is him or the disease. Honestly, I'm inclined to think it's the disease. I've seen him write coherent things and I've seen him write incoherent things, but I haven't seen any instance of him talking coherently in a racist manner.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]