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I have Indian heritage. My parents are incredibly religious. A large part of India is quite religious and Hinduism is the main religion. The brahmin, shudra (c

by nojvek 10y ago

I have Indian heritage. My parents are incredibly religious. A large part of India is quite religious and Hinduism is the main religion. The brahmin, shudra (castes) stems from the ancient scriptures which a lot of people staunchly believe in. From modern point of view a lot of the scriptures are quite racist and sexist to be honest. I have arguments with my family all the time regarding this. I know quite a number of people who legit believe in untouchables. I strongly believe that as India becomes less religious, it will prosper and the people will become happier.

arjie 10y ago
If I were to speculate, I'd say that we're in an atmosphere where cultural innovation is akin to a technological advantage. The free society is stronger. In The Splendid Exchange, William Bernstein argues that a tremendous technological advantage that the Dutch had over the British at one period when both countries competed in trade for spices was that the Dutch financial markets were far more sophisticated. They had voyage derivatives, the ability to buy into a 1/128th share of the voyage's earnings, payments to zielverkoopers (recruiters - sometimes of a predatory sort) that entitled them to a cut of the men's wages as they were earned, derivatives on the zielverkooper contract (the transportbrief), and so on. These financial devices were just as effective as actual technological devices to present an advantage over British trade, a contributing factor to the VOC's success at the time. Analogously, I'd speculate that societies with a high adherence to tradition keeping women at home, or where a person's increased ability cannot increase the likelihood of career success because of a caste or similar system, have built-in limiters on their economy. The free society has a cultural device just as strong as its technological devices: one is closer to allowing one's ability to determine one's success than ever before. I believe the evidence shows that richer, well-fed children grow into smarter people. But while it does that, it only shifts the bell curve to the right. Even the poor can have those with the ingredients to be very smart. And when one discards those people, or condemns half one's population to work at below capacity, one's economy operates below capacity. And that economy will be less able to support the population. The free society will out-compete that economy.
linuxkerneldev 10y ago
> A large part of India is quite religious and Hinduism is the main religion The article mentions: Ahmed, a middle-class slaveholder in Uttar Pradesh in India, was eager to show me around the village where he was a member of the ruling elite. While I was grateful for the warm reception, I was visiting Ahmed’s community because of gross human-rights violations – bonded labour, child exploitation, and outbound human trafficking. My understanding is that Ahmed is an Arabic name and I had been told that Arab people enslaved Indians and that this practice still goes on today. So I'm confused now. Are Hindus enslaving other Hindus? Further, I'm wondering how this all relates to the article. The article doesn't mention religion at all so it is unclear to me whether you're saying Hinduism encourages slavery. I have Hindu friends who told me there is no such thing as "scripture" in Hinduism because there is no "god given" book like Torah, Bible or Quran. So I'm having difficulty understanding what's going on in India.
- chimeracoder 10y ago
  > I have Hindu friends who told me there is no such thing as "scripture" in Hinduism because there is no "god given" book like Torah, Bible or Quran. So I'm having difficulty understanding what's going on in India. There's no short answer to your question. The real "answer" is that Hinduism is a multifaceted religion which encompasses a massive range of different beliefs and practices, which cannot all be neatly classified with a single stroke. To give you some perspective, it's arguably easier to make statements about Abrahamic faiths as a whole (encompassing everything from Satmars to Salafists to Mormons) than it is to make statements about Hinduism as a whole.
  - mercer 10y ago
    > To give you some perspective, it's arguably easier to make statements about Abrahamic faiths as a whole (encompassing everything from Satmars to Salafists to Mormons) than it is to make statements about Hinduism as a whole. I'm not disagreeing, just to be clear, but fascinated by this statement. Could you provide some evidence for it?
whack 10y ago
I agree that many Hindus believe in, and practice the caste system. However, this belief is grounded in culture, and not the Hindu religion itself. The following paper provides a lot of evidence for this. Equating the caste system with Hinduism, would be like equating slavery with Christianity. It would be a shame if we abandoned the world's great religions, simply because of the barbaric things that their followers have done. https://www.jstor.org/stable/4414252?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents https://www.jstor.org/stable/4414252?seq=1#page_scan_tab_con...

by nojvek 10y ago

arjie 10y ago

If I were to speculate, I'd say that we're in an atmosphere where cultural innovation is akin to a technological advantage. The free society is stronger. In The Splendid Exchange, William Bernstein argues that a tremendous technological advantage that the Dutch had over the British at one period when both countries competed in trade for spices was that the Dutch financial markets were far more sophisticated. They had voyage derivatives, the ability to buy into a 1/128th share of the voyage's earnings, payments to zielverkoopers (recruiters - sometimes of a predatory sort) that entitled them to a cut of the men's wages as they were earned, derivatives on the zielverkooper contract (the transportbrief), and so on. These financial devices were just as effective as actual technological devices to present an advantage over British trade, a contributing factor to the VOC's success at the time. Analogously, I'd speculate that societies with a high adherence to tradition keeping women at home, or where a person's increased ability cannot increase the likelihood of career success because of a caste or similar system, have built-in limiters on their economy. The free society has a cultural device just as strong as its technological devices: one is closer to allowing one's ability to determine one's success than ever before. I believe the evidence shows that richer, well-fed children grow into smarter people. But while it does that, it only shifts the bell curve to the right. Even the poor can have those with the ingredients to be very smart. And when one discards those people, or condemns half one's population to work at below capacity, one's economy operates below capacity. And that economy will be less able to support the population. The free society will out-compete that economy.

linuxkerneldev 10y ago

> A large part of India is quite religious and Hinduism is the main religion The article mentions: Ahmed, a middle-class slaveholder in Uttar Pradesh in India, was eager to show me around the village where he was a member of the ruling elite. While I was grateful for the warm reception, I was visiting Ahmed’s community because of gross human-rights violations – bonded labour, child exploitation, and outbound human trafficking. My understanding is that Ahmed is an Arabic name and I had been told that Arab people enslaved Indians and that this practice still goes on today. So I'm confused now. Are Hindus enslaving other Hindus? Further, I'm wondering how this all relates to the article. The article doesn't mention religion at all so it is unclear to me whether you're saying Hinduism encourages slavery. I have Hindu friends who told me there is no such thing as "scripture" in Hinduism because there is no "god given" book like Torah, Bible or Quran. So I'm having difficulty understanding what's going on in India.

chimeracoder 10y ago
> I have Hindu friends who told me there is no such thing as "scripture" in Hinduism because there is no "god given" book like Torah, Bible or Quran. So I'm having difficulty understanding what's going on in India. There's no short answer to your question. The real "answer" is that Hinduism is a multifaceted religion which encompasses a massive range of different beliefs and practices, which cannot all be neatly classified with a single stroke. To give you some perspective, it's arguably easier to make statements about Abrahamic faiths as a whole (encompassing everything from Satmars to Salafists to Mormons) than it is to make statements about Hinduism as a whole.
- mercer 10y ago
  > To give you some perspective, it's arguably easier to make statements about Abrahamic faiths as a whole (encompassing everything from Satmars to Salafists to Mormons) than it is to make statements about Hinduism as a whole. I'm not disagreeing, just to be clear, but fascinated by this statement. Could you provide some evidence for it?

whack 10y ago

I agree that many Hindus believe in, and practice the caste system. However, this belief is grounded in culture, and not the Hindu religion itself. The following paper provides a lot of evidence for this. Equating the caste system with Hinduism, would be like equating slavery with Christianity. It would be a shame if we abandoned the world's great religions, simply because of the barbaric things that their followers have done. https://www.jstor.org/stable/4414252?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents https://www.jstor.org/stable/4414252?seq=1#page_scan_tab_con...